Most Discussed Books (Page 4)

I don't know if anyone's read Liar's Poker by Michael Lewis, but there was a phrase that was in reference to the Salomon Brothers.

It's called equities in Dallas.

And it was this pejorative phrase where if you were assigned to Dallas and you were a finance worker, it was back office.

It was lowest of the low.

You did not want to go there.

It was the backwater of the finance world, Dallas compared to New York.

My first book was called Liars Poking.

It was this little memoir of me working on Wall Street.

Which is, by the way, being made into a film now, right?

It's always being made into a film and never being made into a film.

It's one of those things. Warner Brothers bought it and it's been sitting inside of Warner Brothers for 30 years.

Liars poker is part memoir and part expose of the money harvesting industry

Lewis had done what a lot of smart kids from good schools did back then He got a job at an investment bank in his case Solomon Brothers

Michael Lewis author of the great short or the big short um it was great and a ton of a ton of incredible books he started out with lyre's poker he was a trader back in the 1980s and then ends up writing about layman which then ends up fueling the uh the financial crisis in 2007 2008 with the very mortgage backed securities that he wrote about in lyre's poker which is an incredible book

As a fan of Moneyball, as a fan of The Big Short, Liar's Poker. I thought these were great, great books.

Michael Lewis author of the great short or the big short um it was great and a ton of a ton of incredible books he started out with lyre's poker he was a trader back in the 1980s and then ends up writing about layman which then ends up fueling the uh the financial crisis in 2007 2008 with the very mortgage backed securities that he wrote about in lyre's poker which is an incredible book

That bank was some called Solomon brothers doesn't exist anymore but for anyone has any memory of the financial world that it was the one of the most aggressive doggy dog banks out there there's a famous book written by Michael Lewis call Liars poker about Solomon brothers.

That bank was some called Solomon brothers doesn't exist anymore but for anyone has any memory of the financial world that it was the one of the most aggressive doggy dog banks out there there's a famous book written by Michael Lewis call Liars poker about Solomon brothers.

There's Michael Lewis's Liars poker.

You brought up Liars Poker before and Michael Lewis has just released for the first time an audio book, an unabridged audio book of Liars Poker. But he also put out a companion podcast and the companion podcast is spectacular.

It's very much like Liars Poker. If you've ever read that book about Wall Street, it's Michael Lewis book.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liar's Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liar's Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liar's Poker.

Hey there it's Michael Lewis, Arthur of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

Hey there it's Michael Lewis author of going infinite moneyball the blind side and liars poker

on every season of my podcast against the rules i take a broad look at various characters in american life the referee the coach the expert my next season is all about fans and with the rise of sports betting is doing to them to the teams and even to my family i'm heading to los vegas and new jersey and beyond to understand america's newest form of legalized gambling

on every season of my podcast against the rules i take a broad look at various characters in american life the referee the coach the expert my next season's all about fans and with the rise of sports betting is doing to them to the teams and even to my family i'm heading to los vegas and new jersey and beyond to understand america's newest form of legalized gambling

hey there it's michael lewis author of going infinite money ball the blind side and liars poker

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, Arthur of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, Arthur of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

He writes all these, you know, he writes his first book Liars Poker, which is his sort of young memoir, does these other books all very successful.

we've left one out, which is this great Wall Street book that started it all. Liar's Poker.

Rubin profiled in Michael Lewis' book Liar's Poker for his contributions to the collateralized mortgage obligation market.

But Michael Lewis, that's the guy who wrote Moneyball and The Big Short and Liar's Poker, has been thinking a lot about it.

But Michael Lewis, that's the guy who wrote Moneyball and The Big Short and Liar's Poker, has been thinking a lot about it.

But Michael Lewis, that's the guy who wrote Moneyball and The Big Short and Liar's Poker, has been thinking a lot about it.

But Michael Lewis, that's the guy who wrote Moneyball and The Big Short and Liar's Poker, has been thinking a lot about it.

I think of that liar's poker effect from Michael Lewis where he writes this book about no one really knows what the hell's going on.

Liar's Poker is an amazing book. It's still read today.

Liar's Poker is an amazing book. It's still read today.

Michael Lewis, famed author of Moneyball and Blindside and Liar's Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liar's Poker.

Author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liar's Poker.

Exactly what according to Doris Kearns Goodwin in her wonderful book about Abraham Lincoln, how he surrounded himself with three people who ran against him for the presidency of the United States at that time. They were all in his cabinet and he listened to them.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books or cookbooks.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books or cookbooks.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books or cookbooks. And we discuss them in nauseating detail.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover lots of celebrities' books, be they memoirs, poetry, children's books, or cookbooks.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books or cookbooks. And we discuss them in nauseating detail.

There's a book called like team of rivals. He just got everybody disagreed with.

There's a book called like team of rivals. He just got everybody disagreed with.

The narrative around our cabinet was team of rivals.

It was because there was a book on Abraham Lincoln out with that same name.

Well, you know what? That works too. What I learned from Jennifer Doudna is you have to look inside yourself and say, what is my best approach at being a collaborator, a creative team builder, and I'm going to do it my way and be comfortable with it. I learned that I'm not a particularly great manager.

Well, you know what? That works, too.

What I learned from Jennifer Doudna is you have to look inside yourself and say, what is my best approach at being a collaborator, a creative team builder?

I gave you that book about Lincoln that's a great it's a weird kind of stream of consciousness telling of Lincoln's story in four volumes

it's crazy just the war years just from when he took office and when he was coming here hell was breaking loose

I still think Gary Will's book on Gettysburg is how he wove the Declaration of Independence into the civil rights, into the Constitution, the fabric of it. I think that was a brilliant book.

I still think Gary Will's book on Gettysburg is how he wove the Declaration of Independence into the civil rights, into the Constitution, the fabric of it.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books, or cookbooks.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books or cookbooks.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover lots of celebrities' books, be they memoirs, poetry, children's books, or cookbooks.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books, or cookbooks. And we discuss them in nauseating detail.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books, or cookbooks.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover lots of celebrities' books, be they memoirs, poetry, children's books, or cookbooks.

I was blown away, I was reading Doris Kearns Goodwin's, good one, Team of Rivals, and it's about Abraham Lincoln, and Lincoln is rated by most historians as our best president, right?

we're in the book of Genesis and the book of Abraham. I think it's Genesis 12 through 17, Abraham 1 and 2.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books, or cookbooks.

From Abraham Lincoln to Lauren Graham, John Stamos to Sylvia Plath, we cover memoirs, poetry, children's books, or cookbooks. And we discuss them in nauseating detail.

So the Spielberg movie is specifically about this but Lincoln's Lincoln realizing that you know there's certainly never been a cause more just than the freeing of the slaves and yet he didn't have the votes and he had to horse trade and break some legs and he had to he had to will that constitutional amendment into existence through raw political power these things don't just happen because they are correct.

The Doris Kearns Goodwin book. It's a great book about how some of the best leaders from history have brought people into their cabinets who some of them did not agree with them.

I think one of the best books on political leadership and understanding how to foster public opinion change is Team of Rivals by Doris Kearns Goodwin. It's one of my favorite books.

Doris Kearns Goodwin. Do you even know who that is? Biographer. Famous biographer. Yeah. Team of rivals.

It is a what did they have the team of rivals? I think Doris Kearns Goodwin wrote that great book about all.

Vivek's book is called woke Inc inside corporate America's social justice scam. It's all about ESG.

Ah, thanks Vivek Ramaswamy. Is that Ramaswamy?

Yeah, he does. It's one of his books. Anyway, it's a version of that.

That hurt.

But that's what he is. That's what he was wrote a whole book about. But go ahead.

Vivek Vivek's book is called Woke Inc. Inside Corporate America's Social Justice Scam. It's all about ESG.

Yeah, woke ink was my first book. Wokey, yep, woke ink, yeah that was it.

And I mean, we already know, I think Abel Yall Shryer that wrote the book about the trans stuff that they won't put on the New York Times bestseller list.

And by the way, if you already read A War on Woke and Woke Inc., you're really not going to learn anything from woke warriors.

And by the way, if you already read A War on Woke and Woke Inc... you're really not going to learn anything from Woke Warriors.

He is the author of the books like "Woke Inc.", which attacks social justice movements.

Prior to this, Ramaswamy was the founder and CEO of the biopharmaceutical company Roivant Sciences. Leaving in 2021, he published "Woke, Inc.: Inside Corporate America's Social Justice Scam."

I had written three books...

He's the author of the books like Woke Inc., which attacks social justice movements.

He's the author of the books like Woke Inc., which attacks social justice movements.

Vivek Ramaswamy's Truth

He's the author of the books like Woke Inc., which attacks social justice movements.

It was actually a fantastic book, in my opinion, because it was about ESG and specifically about the takeover and the use of shareholder capitalism to push values that don't necessarily not only align with American public, but really much more hurting the country, using these values and others to go away from the core value of business.

Vivek basically launches his presidential campaign and his media career by writing the anti-woke ink.

Woke ink? Woke ink book.

Woke, Inc. Was the name of his book that really catapulted him into conservative media, et cetera, what started to get him the Daily Wire deal potentially.

In your book, you wrote, quote, the loser of the last election refused to concede the race and claim the election was stolen, raised hundreds of millions of dollars from loyal supporters is considering running for executive office. Again, I'm referring to Donald Trump.

It's exactly what I said in Nation of Victims, and I haven't seen the evidence since, that there was a scale of ballot fraud that would have changed the outcome of the 2020 presidential election.

I've also said in that same book and ever since, that the real way the election was in a narrow sense stolen was the suppression of the Hunter Biden laptop story on the eve of the election.

When I wrote my book, Woke Inc., long before the word woke was in the Republican parlance, I was analyzing a problem that at that point was poorly understood by many Americans in this country.

I think wokeness is just a symptom of our deeper void for purpose and meaning in our country.

Brian Seltter I guess to his credit over there over at CNN he invited Bacchia who we've had here on the show who talked about woke news bad news and why wokeness is bad for the media generally.

In order to discuss both her book in the context of the Virginia election and she basically called him out right to his face eliciting a pretty hilarious reaction.

A lot of this conversation around wokeness is actually about class. We are hiding a class divide in America. We are hiding the just disgusting levels of income inequality in America. We are hiding the total dispossession of the working class of all races by focusing on a very highly specialized academic language around race.

It was actually a fantastic book, in my opinion, because it was about ESG and specifically about the takeover and the use of shareholder capitalism to push values that don't necessarily not only align with American public, but really much more hurting the country, using these values and others to go away from the core value of business.

Vivek is a guy who wrote the Woke Inc book. We've had him here on the show. He's been on the realignment as well.

Brian Seltter I guess to his credit over there over at CNN he invited Bacchia who we've had here on the show who talked about woke news bad news and why wokeness is bad for the media generally.

A lot of this conversation around wokeness is actually about class.

We are hiding a class divide in America.

We are hiding the just disgusting levels of income inequality in America.

We are hiding the total dispossession of the working class of all races by focusing on a very highly specialized academic language around race.

Vivek Ramaswamy's book, uh, "Woke, Inc," I believe it's called.

And he goes through a lot of this stuff where it's not look, they have these, there's this weird thing where like with BlackRock, you know, that they'll be pushing like all the DEI stuff. But then you have these state governments and basically the state governments control the pensions for every government worker in, in the state. So if you think about every government, the only ones who have pensions anymore, you know, government workers, they're controlling hundreds of billions of dollars. And then they will put these rules that say we will only invest it with this financial company. If you insist on DEI regulations and all this stuff, my point is that it's not just coming from the bottom up.

I followed this guy I saw him on CNBC and something told me you know how we used to say back when we were kids something told me to follow this dude I liked what you said it wasn't about politics and ever since then I've been following you uh long since you woke ink book tour I think was yes and you signed that woke ink book to my favorite Iowa legislator thank you very much that's all I gotta say

Several years ago when I wrote my first book woke Inc. I was talking about they were chanting death to America, death to white people, death to Christians.

Woke Inc by Vivek was one of the the first books I read on it that really like set me on this journey of Understanding the high finance like marx's takeover of our economy.

Woke Inc is a wonderful book for people who haven't read it.

Go out and read that book because it really pieces it all together, but he he pieces all of this Together it shows you exactly how these companies have injected themselves into government, right? and And this whole mechanism is using to break down the american spirit.

It's to to to stop us from seeing what we do have in common by constantly throwing in front of our face the politics Of division, you know, and so I'm glad he's running.

And I wrote a couple of books about it and now run another business.

Yeah, Woke Inc.

We definitely talked about this back when it came out or, or something happened where maybe not when it came out but I remember we were talking about last year.

It's, they're both pretty recent.

Yeah, and we were talking about your work and stuff so I'm glad to have you on.

Just go back and read that book. I mean, like he has flip flopped on all the positions that he had in that book.

okay we are talking about the book you sent me and I said okay I'm sorry I don't remember what book was it and then they'll start talking to me about Dostoevsky and the brothers' carol on top which is one of my favorite books and I'll just listen to them talk excitedly for 15 minutes and it's just the most extraordinary thing the most beautiful thing the most satisfying thing to have people creating relationships with ideas and values and understandings that are important to you and have them experience that and that's the thing that I do think is essential and it does come from as the Dalai Lama suggests the return on kindness and compassion you begin to see that it can actually achieve things that hopelessness and fear and anger can't achieve and that's a really exciting idea if you're trying to make it through the world in the 21st century at a time of so much violence in war and conflict and animosity and bigotry and all of these things that we see way too much of yeah it's so easy to get whether we're engaged in the sort of cinematic big work that you're I mean literally cinematic work that you're engaged with or we're just trying to get through in a quote unquote normal life it's easy given our media environment and given what's happening on the planet to get sucked into hopelessness but there is the antidote is around us all the time that's right and it's other people yeah yeah I think that's right and I think in many ways it also allows you to push back against you know fear and anger I do think that fear and anger are the essential ingredients of injustice and oppression they lead to depression and you know and despair and all of these terrible things and we're just living at a time when a lot of people are trafficking in the politics of fear and anger and I mean that broadly not just in our political sphere but in our social spheres and our cultural spheres and educational spheres that people seem to be motivated to use fear and anger as a currency to gain more influence and power that worries me because I look through world history and I see the worst and most tragic manifestations of human behavior rooted in these narratives of fear and anger the Holocaust was created by a narrative of fear and anger that were wandered in genocide a hundred days that was facilitated by this powerful a narrative of fear and anger you go any place in the world where people are being abused and mistreated if you talk to the abusers and those who are mistreating them they can give you a narrative of fear and anger to justify and defend what they are doing and I just think that fear and anger causes you to tolerate things you would not otherwise tolerate it causes you to accept things you would not otherwise accept how did we reconcile ourselves to be in slavers in this country to have millions of people violated and abused and say we mob violence throughout the 20th century the first half of the 20th century where black people pulled out of their homes and beaten and drowned and tortured and lynched sometimes on the courthouse lawn and and some of these mob members would bring their children to witness the torture and the violence and how is it that that would be a reasonable or rational thing to do even the architecture of segregation that I grew up with why this intense hatred of people because of their color not wanting them to sit where you sit not wanting them to eat where you eat go through the door where you go through all of that is rooted in these narratives of fear and anger many of which we inherit and if we don't consciously work to overcome they shape our lives and will feel rage in ways that we don't even understand and that's why for me countering that challenging that is so essential it doesn't mean we have to all agree on policies or issues or topics but we do have to understand that we don't make good decisions when those decisions are shaped by our worst fears or by our rage and anger and hope is the most powerful antidote to that and hope rooted in compassion and kindness hope rooted in the belief that we can do more than just rage at one another be afraid of one another hate one another I want to get on the other side of that because I don't want to be burdened by those things either and and in many ways it's a legacy that I feel fortunate to have inherited I mean when I look at American history I think about the four million people who were emancipated after the Civil War it would not have been irrational for them to say we want retribution against those who enslaved us who separated us from our children and our family members but most of them chose citizenship they chose fellowship they chose community was an act of hope that you could argue wasn't rational but it was powerful and all during that time of exclusion in disfavored I feel fortunate that were people in my ear saying don't hate those who exclude you don't hate those who don't want you to go to school with them who don't think you should be in the pool with them who don't want to sit next to you because if you do that you'll be defined by your hatred you'll be burdening yourself more than they could ever burden you and that relationship to a life for me is really essential because there are so many things that are enraging there are so many things that are oppressive there are so many things that are just heartbreaking when you see how humans interact with on another that it's very easy to get pulled into that narrative of fear and anger that can shape your whole life coming up Brian Stevenson talks about what he does when he sees fear and anger coming up in his own mind how he's learned to think about people he encounters along the way who he feels are abusing their power or acting in otherwise ugly ways and why he thinks it's important not just to criticize but also to state out loud your highest aspirations repeatedly

There are a couple of passages in *The Brothers Karamazov* that really kind of connect with that.

These books included the whole library of classics, the library of world literature including Dante and Shakespeare and Zola and Montesquieu and Russo and Diderot.

Yeah, I was rereading the Brothers Karamazov. It's my favorite book. It's still funny, after 200 years or whatever the fuck.

It's the same idea incidentally that is in Dostoevsky's famous example in The Brothers Karamazov where he poses the question, suppose you could create utopia forever basically, peace on earth forever, but to do so you first have to torture this little child in front of you.

Torture the child to death I think he says, I don't remember exactly.

I've on the terrible Ivan Grozny. That's what they call him. I've on the terrible do Chayefsky. I've read Kafka. I've read I've a lot of Russian shit.

I was reminded of actually one of my favorite stories about Christ actually which came from not the Bible but from Fyodor Dostoevsky's book the brothers Karamazov...

You see something similar happening in the brothers Karamazov yeah because you have Ivan is a very is very able to put forward extremely compelling propositionly atheistic arguments right in kind of a Nietzschean spirit in real sense right and alliosa who's the monastic novitiate is no match for Ivan on the propositional front but he's a way better person

He says life is so right with catastrophe and suffering betrayal malevolence it's so intrinsically unworthy that it would be better if consciousness itself was just brought to an end.

Okay, so let's take that, let's take that argument apart because you you put your finger on the postmodern quandary right because the postmodernists in some sense the reason that they ran into trouble with assuming they criticized the notion that there was a canonical interpretation of the text because there's so many subjective interpretations of any text in fact there's a near infinite number of potential subjective interpretations of any text just like there's almost an infinite number of places you could be looking right now and so it's a huge deep problem so and when you say that you can project something onto the text that in some sense isn't there that's also an extremely deep problem and these problems are deep enough you know the fact of multiple interpretations of a single reality is so pervasive that it stopped AI researchers it's the thing that stopped AI researchers from being able to build functional robots like it's a killer problem yeah yeah okay so if that's the frame problem okay so let's let's agree that that exists but we should also agree and partly I think by the merits of your own argument that we do have a reliable subjective intuition that texts differ in depth yeah and that that means something so I'm going to propose what it means and you tell me what you think about this okay sure so one of the ways that we specify where to look at is by looking at what we deem to be important and so here's a way of conceptualizing that and it sort of maps on to the idea of the phoVA extending outward to less high-resolution consciousness so I write a sentence because I want to write a paragraph I write a paragraph because I want to sequence paragraphs into a book a chapter I write chapters to sequence them into a book I write a book because I want to be a practicing scientist I want to be a practicing scientist because I'm a good citizen I want to be a good citizen hypothetically because I want to be a good person you know and maybe I want to be a good person to avoid the hell that you described okay so those are nested value structures and we see the world through that structure simultaneously the whole thing is there and if one part of it collapses we make reference to the part that contains it that's how we don't crash like a computer now that now the navigation that you described these nested structures their navigation maps as far as I can tell now okay so here's the depth issue some maps have more other maps dependent on them than other maps do okay so if I go into your map structure some of that's even propositionalized and I mess about with the deeper axiomatic propositions upon which many other propositions rest then that's going to disturb you fundamentally and that's part of that experience of depth and you know look look you get much more if you're married and you love your wife you're much more upset if she divorces you than if you have an argument about who should do the dishes well why well because the stability of your marriage is a precondition for all sorts of other ways that you perceive the world and if that's violated well that's traumatic yeah so when we so and the reason I'm trying to get this clear with you is because you think clearly about these things but also because it allows to it allows for clarification of language in some sense so we could say that as you go deeper into that nested structure what you approach becomes more and more sacred by definition I'm trying to define it experientially because the so let's say you're transformed at a fundamental level that means something shifts way down deep and that's how you feel it even in an embodied sense and and what we've defined as as human beings as religious as far as I can tell or as sacred is our attempt to define the landscape that is characterized by those deepest structures of maps now what you're talking about I think is outside the map system altogether in some sense you know it's the container for all of it yeah yeah it is in some sense because or it's or thoghnall to it I mean it penetrates it at every point but it's not reducible to it and I mean that's why it's so consequential so for instance I think you can so taking accepting your your picture of nested maps and and depth and all that I agree with all of that and maps can be more or less useful in more or less in register with with the reality they're purporting to describe right so you can have faulty maps and in science we really try to get an accurate map and and we have a high resolution yeah and we have a language game which is when it's working is optimized to you know as Richard Feynman famously said not fooling ourselves right I mean that's like the master value of not fooling yourself whereas I would argue in in religious discourse not fooling yourself is not a master value and in fact you know so much of what goes by the name of religious faith okay but let me put that in terminology then because you talk about the sacred right and and and you accept that and and you also and you also see it as revivifying and and and and crucial to the prevention of suffering yeah but you juxtapose that against religion and so what what's the difference as far as your concern between what sacred and what's religious uh yeah good question well so maybe the best way to get at it is by reference to a principle which is I think what I think anything that's true right and this is this is true scientifically descriptively but it's true spiritually and it's true with respect to anything we would call sacred anything that's true anything that's real is discoverable now right it's like a little like like if we if we lost everything if we lost all the books if we lost all the tools if we lost everything and we just found ourselves having to reboot not only civilization but human cognition you know everything that is real is discoverable from that starting point even if you're even if you're starting zero again now we would we would talk about it differently we would have you know we would we would have memories of what what you know some of us would have memories of all that we've lost and that would anchor us to certain expectations but the point is what is true what is real what is what is what is the real opportunity for a direct self-transcendent engagement with reality right what what is the real opportunity for let me take exception let me take exception to that in one manner I see what you mean I understand what you mean I believe but here's here's a potential problem with that so I'm not saying let me just close it or do it possible misunderstanding I'm not saying that we shouldn't stand on the shoulders of giants and I'm not saying tradition is useless in fact either you know I would I would probably agree with you that that we should be fairly conservative in how we in how we overthrow our traditions I mean so I'm not I'm not arguing that we should just be radical iconic lasts the tears that we should tear everything down to the studs and start again that's not that's not what I'm I have okay well what's the difference but what's the difference in your vision then between the tradition that you would be conservative about and religion I'm not trying to corner you I'm just trying to see how you're making the distinction exceptionally it comes down to very specific claims that that I think are clearly false and which many of our religions advertise as not only important but indispensable for their projects so to take Islam as a specific example is I mean Islam mainstream Islam not just al-Qaeda style Islam just any Islam that really is worthy of the name in the year 2021 is founded on the claim that the Quran is the literal word of God and it is yeah but in the minds of most Muslims most of the time it means that these stanzas were dictated to Muhammad in his cave by the archangel Gabriel and he was he was commanded to recite and he recited them and what we have here is in truth the claim the the Orthodox claim is is even more stringent than what the seemingly analogous you know fundamentalist religion Christian claim about the Bible it's not just that the text itself is verbatim what God said uh it's that the document itself is in fact like every instantiation of the physical document is itself the word of God it's like it's it's there's sort of a double layer of sacredness to it well is it cannot be edited okay is it this is a problem that claim or is it the problem that the people who purport to understand it claim to be 100% right no no but the problem is that given that claim and given the actual contents of the book yeah which you have is an endless source of divisiveness and conflict like if you dignify that claim okay this is the most important series of utterances ever expressed on earth this is it let's find out what the creator of the universe wants us to know what he wants us to know above all else is that one we should hate and fear and despise and resist and never befriend unbelievers right that's that's that message comes through on virtually every page and a hell has been prepared for these unbelievers where their skins will be endlessly burned off of them and and replenished so that they can be tortured and new right do you think there's any relationship between that claim and your observation that failure to take refuge in the sacred as you laid it out dooms you to possession by the default network and puts you into a hell okay so it is possible to give a very enlightened reading of this text or really any text that that allows you to step out of its divisive and toxic implications so I would support that kind of reading you know if we were joined in this conversation by by Muslim scholars who said no no don't you understand Jordan's spiritual interpretation of this admonishment is precisely what God intended he intended it to be to be an engine not of hate and division and sectarian tribalism he intended it to be a device that would allow you to recognize the emotional and cognitive implications of of being caught by dualism say right like really you know etc etc he goes far as you want in that direction that'd be great the problem is the book itself gives no indication that your interpretation is the right one in fact it gives every indication that it's not and then it's heterodontous.

because the God who created this universe if it was created by God is quite clearly a maniac

other maniac Ivan in the brothers Karamazov

it's very interesting I would urge everyone to read the brothers Karamazov because I do think it's a work of genius

and and it's so interesting how it works in in the brothers Karamazov Dostoevsky pits Ivan against Iliocia and Ivan is handsome and debonair and he's he's the warrior type that you just described he's very atheistic and he can put up a pretty good argument you know he he tortures his brother who's a monastic novigiant with stories of children locked in outhouses overnight and freezing to death they were punished by their parents which Dostoevsky took from a newspaper and said I don't I cannot possibly imagine how there could be a god who is omniscient and and had all the other classic attributes of God who could create a universe where that was allowed to happen even once and Ivan it can out debate Iliocia consistently but Iliocia's character is such that he wins the argument he loses all the battles in some sense but wins the war and that's something you can really portray when you clothe your ideas in characters or or when the characters are even more I think to the point is when the characters are so profound that they're acting out ideas that you couldn't yet make explicit no and that is one of the things that that narrative does is that it enables us to play out ideas that were not yet intelligent enough to understand and sometimes the gap between the narrative representation and the explicit understanding can be thousands and thousands of years because we're still unwrapping while we're certainly still unwrapping the Bible we're unwrapping we're still unwrapping Shakespeare there's more depth there than we can then we can understand explicitly and so anything that uses character has that tremendous advantage and then also there's also this strange ability that some people have in spades to create fictional worlds that are of unbelievable profundity and power and I mean the greatest example of that in the last 30 years in terms of sheer imaginative powers gotta be JK rolling and the Harry Potter series which you know grip the imagination of the entire planet for for a decade and produced untold wealth and spread literacy everywhere as well she had an unremarkably creative imagination and something quite mysterious

And Dostoevsky's Ivan makes that case in the brothers Karamazov brilliantly brilliantly he tortures his brother Aliyosha who's the novitiate and it's a very interesting book because Aliyosha is nowhere near the retoration that Ivan is but he is the most admirable character in the book because of the totality of his personality not because of the brilliance of his rational mind it's amazing book in that regard but the problem I had with Benatar's hypothesis wasn't it's it's axiom because I think you can make a strong case that there's so much suffering in the world that the question of its validity is a valid question the problem for me there is that if you do that and you start to act that out things take a things appear to take a vicious turn very rapidly you start working against everything that's alive and striving yes and no quite right

One of the greatest novels in the history of the world is by a Dostoevsky called The Brothers Karamazov.

And in that, the most Christ-like fictional character ever created is introduced to us. It's an Eastern Orthodox, a Russian Orthodox novice. He's studying in a monastery. His name is Alyosha.

He represents the good spirit in all of us. He is the spirit of Christianity, beautiful, beautiful individual. And he just goes around doing good. And he is trained by an old father named Zosima, who's also a delight for you. Love these two characters.

Yes, him, him did he approach the little wise and old man with fine wrinkles on his face joyful and quietly laughing. He's eyes shown. He too was at the feast. Had also been called to the wedding in Cana of Galilee. I too, dear fellow have been called.

Called in summoned the quiet voice said clearly above him. You too must come and be with us. Let us be Mary and gay. The little wise and old man continued.

Studying Anna Karanah and Brothers Karamazov and the great Russian literary masters, Dostoevsky, Tolstoy, Chakov, it opened me up to the idea that my libertarian worldview of voluntarism and consent for literally the only moral principles was so small, so beneath the reality of like how deep the human mind goes, how much the soul really exists and that you actually cannot reduce man to voluntarism and consent.

He reads Russian classics like Tolstoy and Dostoevsky.

And the final step I guess in my journey was the brothers Karamontsoff.

It's about the reality of commitment. It's about knowing that you're living an honest life and knowing when you're not basically and it's about family. It's done within family and community.

It's not something that you can easily shake. It's not a work that you can put down and pick up something else and not reflect. You'll find yourself going back to it again and again and again.

It was a Dorothy Day's favorite book as well.

And that did it, you know, it got me in ways that I could not have imagined. I stayed up nights I took me a week to read it.

it's a great novel and I would recommend it unless you want your life changed

it's about the reality of commitment it's about knowing that you're living an honest life and knowing when you're not basically and it's about family it's done within family and community and it's not something that you can easily shake it's not a work that you can put down and pick up something else and not reflect you find yourself going back to it again and again and again

it was a Dorothy Day's favorite book as well I have read it she would reread it and talk about it and write about it

Dr. Shafty had a grip on the reality of life as it is and you know he was a habitual gambler he was not a celebrated man in many respects but he long to live an honest and free life because that's really where we find the presence of God or the one the other whatever we express as a higher power that we are part of a community and that work does Shafty's work specifically in that book is about being a part of a community and not being able to let it go without a severe penalty

And the final step I guess in my journey was the brothers Karamontsoff.

It's about the reality of commitment. It's about knowing that you're living an honest life and knowing when you're not basically and it's about family. It's done within family and community.

It's not something that you can easily shake. It's not a work that you can put down and pick up something else and not reflect. You'll find yourself going back to it again and again and again.

And that did it, you know, it got me in ways that I could not have imagined. I stayed up nights I took me a week to read it.

it's a great novel and I would recommend it unless you want your life changed

it's about the reality of commitment it's about knowing that you're living an honest life and knowing when you're not basically and it's about family it's done within family and community and it's not something that you can easily shake it's not a work that you can put down and pick up something else and not reflect you find yourself going back to it again and again and again

it was over a thousand pages

it got me in ways that I could not have imagined I stayed up nights I took me a week read it

he said a lot of my boy so I want to live and go on living even if it's contrary to the rules of logic even if I do not believe in the divine order of things the sticky young leaves are merging from their buds in this spring are dear to my heart so is the blue sky and so are some human beings even though I often don't know why I like them I'll get drunk on my own emotion I love these sticky little leaves and the blue sky that's what you don't love those things with reason with logic you love them with your innerts with your belly yes

he said a lot of my boy so I want to live and go on living even if it's contrary to the rules of logic even if I do not believe in the divine order of things the sticky young leaves are merging from their buds in this spring are dear to my heart so is the blue sky and so are some human beings even though I often don't know why I like them I'll get drunk on my own emotion I love these sticky little leaves and the blue sky that's what you don't love those things with reason with logic you love them with your innerts with your belly

I believe this is in the Brothers Karamazov. I believe that like a child, that suffering will be healed and made up for, that all the humiliating absurdity of human contradictions will vanish like a painful mirage, that in the world's finale, at the moment of eternal harmony, something so precious will come to pass that it will suffice for all hearts, for the comforting of all resentments, for the atonement of all the crimes of humanity, of all the blood that they shed, that it will make it not only possible to forgive, but to justify all that has happened.

maybe we could do that by referring to the Grand Inquisitor in 'The Brothers Karamazov'.

I feel like Kyle just wherever she goes has the latest Leanne Moriarty book and that's it and she's never read a damn one she's just gonna tell everybody she read it while she's waiting for a Reese Witherspoon to make a movie out of it or something a TV show out of it

I feel like Kyle just wherever she goes has the latest Leanne Moriarty book and that's it and she's never read she's just gonna tell everybody she read it while she's waiting for Reese Witherspoon to make a movie out of it or something a TV show out of it

And I'm listening to Brothers Karamazov right now. And it puts me to sleep. There are so many Russian names. I'm just struggling to keep up with who they're talking about. And it's so exhausting. I wouldn't ever be able to do audiobook on something like that.

And I'm listening to Brothers Carmao's off right now.

yeah, well, certainly I read crime and punishment and it was easier to follow than Brothers Carmao's off on audible.

My favorite book, which is, well, my two favorite books, Crime and Punishment and Brothers Karamazov.

Kind of like a concierge, kind of like Tom Hagen, the lawyer on The Godfather.

Introducing The Godfather at champacasino.com

Test your luck on the shadowy world of The Godfather slot.

Someday, I will call upon you to do a service for me.

Play The Godfather now at champacasino.com

Welcome to the family.

It's like everything is gonna be like if you saw like the first two Godfather movies your mind is gonna be blown

But one, the godfather was a book and then an epic movie. Two, I don't believe he's actually ever read the book. I'm not sure he's totally watched the movie because he can't pick out his favorite quote.

But three, that's just a movie and a book. The reality is everyone knows, and why wouldn't you? Why wouldn't you discuss with your best player what's it look like? Why wouldn't you understand what you're walking into? Or if you're taking the job, are you going to be here?

But one, the godfather was a book and then an epic movie.

I'm not sure he's totally watched the movie because he can't pick out his favorite quote.

All I can think of is the godfather, which, of course, has the answers to everything. Frank Pentangeli was called. He was going to speak before the Senate. He was going to testify as Michael Corleone was being cross-examined. And they had him. He had turned state's evidence. He was going to testify against him. And then what happened? He didn't do it, even though he'd already given it all up to the feds because they had his brother.

They dragged in his brother from Italy. He was sitting there in the audience and they knew exactly what was going to happen to the brother. I think it was the brother or the uncle if he spoke and said those things under oath. And so suddenly Frank Pentangeli is like, they came to me. They started putting all kinds of words in my mouth. Michael Corleone did this. Michael Corleone did that. So I said, yeah, yeah, he did it. And he totally reversed himself.

That's what they just did to Joe Biden. They had Joe Biden's library. That was the uncle. The library gets it. You leave, the library gets it, your legacy gets it.

And so he did what Frank Pentangeli did. He said, all right, fine, I'll do it. And he's out.

Ford Coppola had this great thing when he was writing The Godfather and he printed it as a book all his notes every scene has something he calls the core so it might just be this person has to meet this person and they have to realize they have a disagreement but he knows what the purpose of everything is.

They are so good as good or better than the movies and the movies are in my opinion some of the best of all time.

I finally saw The Godfather.

And it was really good.

And then I just watched that part two like two days ago, three days ago.

Now they say that part two is better than the first.

They're both excellent.

But I always found that exciting and it was always something that I was interested in and I knew well before well before high school. That's what I wanted to do.

It was either, you know, pitching for the Mets. It didn't work out or, you know, I always had an interest in the law. I always liked history from a very young age. I don't know. Maybe it was watching, you know, my cousin Vinny, you know, or a few good men.

TJ English He did the podcast with me and Rogan and he said in his 30 40 years Experience dealing with Cuban people were always very vindictive.

He wrote about that guy was about a godfather, you know about a crime godfather.

I think after episode 7 they really HBO did not want Tony Killing somebody.

my first encounter with him because I grew up on the Godfather movies and then Serpico and Dog Day Afternoon and he is such above a star to me he's something else

The Godfather has been written and they're going to be turning into a movie and he wants to be in The Godfather.

But he at the same time hates Mario Puzo, the author, for putting... We got to kick him off the project. He can't have written this thing.

Which people all assume is based on Sinatra.

Paramount almost by accident got the film rights to a novel by a writer named Mario Puzo. The novel was The Godfather.

Because Columbo was not at all happy about the movie.

The league called Bob Evans up and threatened him. We don't want that movie made. If that movie made, someone's going to get hurt.

So to answer your question, I am not going to go tell them they don't even know me.

Chutzpah is a bunch of violent mobsters threatening to shut down a movie because it depicts them as violent mobsters. Chutzpah is tricking them because they're too lazy to read the script.

Or the electrical cord to his neck. Or the electrical cord or whatever was there, but it doesn't look like the fabric from a bed sheet. So if it seems clear just from the photographs of his autopsy that he was strangled with, say, a cord, wouldn't you test that cord for his DNA?

So the autopsy photographs show that the ligature mark on Jeff's neck is in the middle of his neck and goes straight back, as if someone put a rope around his neck and strangled him like Carlo in The Godfather in the car.

the Edmonton Public School Board... decided to ban 1984, The Godfather, Jaws, and so on, in addition to The Handmaid's Tale.

I think this is the best thing I've read since The Godfather.

I married into an old brother family... it's that or The Godfather.

There's no way this can be good because it's someone saying, no, we're doing a TV show about the Godfather one and two. I just think that's going to be terrible.

Francis Ford Coppola is going to make The Godfather.

I was obsessed with The Godfather. One of the first movies I saw was The Godfather 2.

This is the game Marlon Brando was playing when he secured the role for The Godfather.

He was old in The Godfather and that came out in 1972.

I have seen The Godfather too.

It will never be able to write a book like the Lord of the Rings or make a movie like The Godfather.

like trying to remake The Godfather to repaint the Mona Lisa. It cannot possibly capture that same beauty and majesty once again.

And Fredo, of course, is one of the brothers in The Godfather, kind of the flunky, stupid brother

I've been reading a lot of books like I just read Jeanette McCurdy's book and even that like that must have been so hard for I guess her mom died so that was like a cool thing that she was able to like probably would have been a completely different book had her mom been alive

Jim Jenette McCurdy who's an actress who was one on one of these shows uh who that was produced by Dan Schneider who's got all these like pending out like people are starting to say he was you know very inappropriate especially with the female young female actresses uh sure at this book that went viral because it's called I'm Glad My Mom is Dead and talked about her growing up in um you know in Hollywood and what that experience life but she alluded to the experiences she had on such she didn't come out I it's probably for when I remember about it she didn't come out and say these are the names who these are who she should go after but the book was so popular it was you know on because the title so flashy everyone heard about it it wasn't a secret

So that was my understanding of a title, but thankfully we picked a better title, I think. And now that gets to live as a chapter title, which is better for me, but I think it worked out for the best, but the title was pretty difficult to come up with. I'm just proud. I came up with it. I like an inflammatory title and loud still kind of probes. Absolutely. It would have been crazy to be like, my eyes are up here.

The duo follow story. Like, it's like what? Or like, you know, I like the idea of like a catchy title, but I do get that. That was a little dark. That's what they told me. I was like, especially with after having written the whole thing and the manuscript and everything, even my editor was like, I think that this title works in better context after you read it.

Like after you read it, you're like, oh, that makes sense because it's like satirical in its very nature. And he's like, but that's not like what you want a title to be. And I was like, all right, I guess I'll trust you man who works in publishing for 20 years. Guess I'll trust you.

I'm just proud. I came up with it. I like an inflammatory title and loud still kind of probes. Absolutely. It would have been crazy to be like, my eyes are up here.

But I was thinking in the same vein as like Jeanette McCurdy's book, which is like, I'm glad my mom died. It's like, that's not necessarily true, but it's like catchy.

It's fantastic. And that, I mean, that I think is the most incredible example of what a lot of these other people...

It was just an incredible book. I remember sitting, I read it last year when it came out and I was just, I mean, full, just tears reading it because these are the stories of the people that I grew up with. They're the things that I saw but was protected against.

Jenette McCurdy wrote her fantastic book "I'm Glad My Mom Died" about her very abusive mother momager and her experience with Dan Schneider.

And then I remember getting to the end of her book, literally just like crying because I was.

I listened to a book that's a memoir that I really loved that made me remember that we wrote a memoir. Yeah. And in that way.

So this chick, Jeanette McCurdy, do you know her book, I'm Glad My Mom Died? She just, it just came out. I fucking listened to it too.

It was fucking unbelievable.

It was really good.

It's ballsy and hilarious and heartbreaking at the same time. And so good.

I mean, the dam kind of broke that one of the one of those members that is a Max Miller that went on the floor and said he personally stole five thousand dollars from my mother.

I've been reading a lot of books like I just read Jeanette McCurdy's book and even that like that must have been so hard for her.

I guess her mom died so that was like a cool thing that she was able to like it probably would have been a completely different book had her mom been alive and I think I'm right.

Like she's Cody from serves up Streisand's autobiography follows on the heels of books from celebs like Viala Davis Jeanette Mercurdy, Matthew Perry, Pamela Anderson, Jada Pinkett Smith, Britney Spears and of course Prince Harry

And then she reveals that her mom was an abusive stage mother, which reminds me very much of the Jeanette McCready book in which she said, I'm glad my mother died.

And she said, oh, my mom hit me with this hairbrush that's character Lily Rose did to get me to perform.

Even with Jeanette McCurdy's book. Yes. She did a great book yeah.

They wanted to give her $300,000 to sign something when the show ended that she would never talk about Nickelodeon or Dan Schneider.

So in the book she calls him the creator but, and I'm sure that he did it because he had a food fetish.

And she even said, God, at one point I was like, what was I thinking?

And it's really interesting because it's like, it's that whole child star thing.

And she gets her, she's supposed to have her own spinoff show. Instead, they put her with another star and it's called Cat and Sam and she's the lead.

And she starts to talk about this in her book. And then the book is called I'm Glad My Mom Died.

And she had some mental, some physical things like cancer and she did pass away.

She's very candid about how jealous she was of Ariana Grande, who at that time wasn't the musical superstar that she is today.

She's like, I'm jealous about this because I come from nothing. She comes from Boca Raton. Her mother buys her Gucci bags. She's had all these opportunities.

I wonder what's your personal narrative of being a child star and how you came through that because we don't hear you talk about that too much.

I thank them in the front of our book, one of the, I thank the Spice Girls and my mom.

All those difficulties that Jimmy Kimmel was pointing to in Hunter's life, mental health problems, addiction issues, he has written about in this book.

He is just as if you think about what's in the book, it's just hard to imagine other than like Mike Barnacle's autobiography. It's hard to imagine anything more horrifying than the things he's already admitted to in that book.

The thing that the committee should be most afraid of is that Hunter has done damage to himself.

The self-inflicted damage that Hunter has done to himself is awful and he will he will cop to it.

I think for many people is seen as not just something funny, not just a story that's interesting, but in many ways a cathartic exploration of how we see the relationships that we have with many of our parents, our caregivers, whoever it was in our world because you wrote a book entitled I'm Glad My Mom Died and it is a massive hit.

I definitely don't hate my mom. I think she was a really complicated and nuanced person and I try to kind of articulate her to the best of my ability in all of her many shades and colors.

getting to the place where I was finally glad and relieved that she was dead, you know, it took me so long to be able to accept that reality.

I felt even if they did, it was a message worth sharing. I really, I really mean that.

I'm glad my mom died is available now wherever you buy a book.

It is a massive hit. So two questions. One, did you hate your mom? And two, does everybody?

I definitely don't hate my mom. I think she was a really complicated and nuanced person and I try to kind of articulate her to the best of my ability in all of her many shades and colors.

getting to the place where I was finally glad and relieved that she was dead, you know, it took me so long to be able to accept that reality.

I think it's way more common than anyone would care to admit. I know just from my experience of going into auditions countless times I'd have like 103 feet for my mom would be having me chug Gatorade. I'd be walking into like pretend to be a homeless child which is just already so kind of messed up as it is.

With my mom, I haven't gotten to a place of forgiveness. I was trying to get to a place of forgiveness for so long. In therapy, I would sort of plead almost with my therapist like, why am I not able to get to this place? What is...what's wrong with me that I'm not able to forgive my mom for this abuse? Why am I so terrible that I can't get to that place?

I haven't actually read her book but I've seen her interviews and she talks about how like there was a lot that she felt ashamed to say while her mom was still alive because it's like obviously like like I still love my mom and stuff and like there I don't want to you know like if I told the truth like it would be crazy you know what I mean but it's so frustrating to be in a text thread with only me and try to convince me that I'm making things up.

I'm glad my mom died.

I'm sure most of you have heard of the book and movie called Gone Girl. It's very, very popular. It's about this woman who fakes her death and pins it on her husband.

And this is what Fotus's attorney said Jennifer did. He said that she had the quote, imagination, means and motive to disappear and make it look like her husband was responsible.

She was a writer and she'd written a book very similar to Gone Girl where the woman fakes her own missing and everything to get a cheating husband back played by Ben Affleck.

Sherry's hoax came two years after Gone Girl the novel by Gillian Flynn came out

In that spoilers the main character also runs off to a helpless ex-boyfriend who was smitten with her

I mean I know gone girl I read it came out before she did this but she could have gotten the ideas like was she like I want out of this life I'm gonna set it up and look like maybe he killed me or whatever and then she realized oh crap they're gonna find me now I've got to switch tactics was she doing it knowing she was coming back the ex-boyfriend basically said she was talking about how she just needed a break and wanted to get away from her husband and all of the sudden one day she was just like I want to go home like then literally go to Mexico like take a month and say hey hey husband I'm depressed I want to I'm going on a month vacation and you can leave me like what

It's not like the story of Gone Girl.

The woman, that very popular book in the movie that frames the husband for the killing.

I've seen it multiple times, actually. It's a great movie, great book, but I don't buy it.

The Gone Girl theory is such an insult to Jennifer's family.

Pate said Jennifer wrote an unpublished novel echoing the plot of the popular book Gone Girl, which later became a hit film starring Ben Affleck and Rosamund Pike.

Spoiler alert, it's a twisted tale of a woman who vanishes, leaving a trail of evidence to frame her husband for her murder.

Pattis says Jennifer wrote an unpublished novel which echoes the plot of the popular book Gone Girl, the twisted tale of a woman who vanishes, leaving a trail of evidence to frame her husband for her murder.

So what are you arguing about this manuscript and her state of mind? Desperate, frantic, concerned that Fotis might be having more time with the children, willing to do just about anything to prevent that.

Creative, had the ability to think outside the box. We don't know where she is. She may well have killed herself. We don't know. We are investigating that.

You've heard of Gone Girl. What about Gone Goat?

I'm really late on reading this book. I'm really late on reading Gone Girl.

No when they do because Hollywood keeps remaking movies now because everybody stole the movies so they can't they can't do anything originally Marcus What's the point? They just got to keep doing shit that works

So they'll do the black version of it which will be where'd the bitch go and then Paul Paul Will do the all-female one and I'll turn it into a fucking 10 zillion dollar comedy where the dude bro go.

But I'm really late on reading this book. I'm really late on reading Gone Girl. We saw the movie ages ago, obviously.

You did and you read Gong Girl before you watched the movie.

A lot of people compare this case to the best-selling novel and Academy Award nominated film Gone Girl.

It's about a woman who is married to a man and becomes so resentful of him that she creates a false account of domestic abuse and then fakes her own abduction, rape, and attack.

Her original plan was to kill herself and have her husband blamed for the murder but then she changes her mind and the narrative of her story.

She then escapes her attacker in hopes of rebuilding her marriage.

She appears on TV and gains success and attention for this fabricated story so a lot of people see potential similarities from this story and Sherry's but again, she didn't seek attention at all after her disappearance and she actually did the opposite.

And Patis even suggested that Jennifer had tried to set up her husband, that she had borrowed from the plot of the book and movie Gone Girl and was trying to frame her husband for murder.

As early as March 26th, one day after the kidnapper had released his daughter, the kidnapper had released Denise, reporters began to compare her to the fictional character in the 2012 crime novel by Gillian Flynn. The movie version was released in 2014 with Ben Affleck and Rosamund Pike.

In Gone Girl, a man is the primary suspect in the disappearance of his wife. It then comes out that the wife staged her own disappearance and made her husband look guilty in order to get back at him for cheating on her.

At one point, an FBI agent asked Denise's lawyer, have you ever watched the movie Gone Girl? It'll explain a lot.

It wasn't just a popular narrative in the press. At one point, an FBI agent asked Denise's lawyer, have you ever watched the movie Gone Girl? It'll explain a lot.

Their conclusions were based off of fictional stories. They want to say our case was too strange to be believed.

As early as March 26th, one day after the kidnapper had released Denise, reporters began to compare her to the fictional character in the 2012 crime novel by Gillian Flynn.

In Gone Girl, a man is the primary suspect in the disappearance of his wife. It then comes out that the wife staged her own disappearance and made her husband look guilty in order to get back at him for cheating on her.

It wasn't just a popular narrative in the press. At one point, an FBI agent asked Denise's lawyer, have you ever watched the movie Gone Girl? It'll explain a lot.

They want to say our case was too strange to be believed.

I think it's unbelievable that they're basing the thing off a movie, a novel. That's shocking to me.

Even people Denise thought were her friends were sharing stories on Facebook with headlines like, Real Life Gone Girl Allegedly Staged Her Own Insane Fake Kidnapping.

He also told Misty that his car had been stolen very close to the time when a woman named Denise Huskins had been kidnapped, and that the Vallejo police had dismissed it as a Gone Girl hoax.

My face, my name was Gone Girl, you know?

And supposedly I was replicating something I didn't know anything about.

But when I did watch the movie, I mean, before that I would kind of go back and forth. I should have done this. I should have fought back. So then I'd have bruises.

So they would believe me. And I just kept battling with myself about it until I watched that movie.

I realized it didn't matter what I did or said if I had more gruesome injuries because she hit herself in the face with a hammer.

She was very dramatic when she's released, and I was told I was too calm.

So it was clear that they had decided before I was even released that they didn't believe me.

And so it didn't matter how I acted.

I saw something in the news the other day that reminded me a lot of Gillian Flynn's Gone Girl book and movie that came out.

I read Gone Girl back in the day, way before this, I'm wondering if this woman was inspired by the book for some weird reason.

I was sort of loosely attached to Gone Girl at one point.

Then I think maybe that very famous book, The Giving Tree.

I think growing up it was about, oh, this really generous tree that just gave and gave and gave until there was nothing left.

So now there is nothing left to give to anybody else.

And now here's a fact check of today's conversation. In the first half of the show, Angela expresses her enthusiasm for Amazon's leadership principle, disagree but commit completely. The principle is actually half backbone, disagree and commit.

The phrase disagree and commit has also been attributed to former Intel CEO Andrew Grove and Tucson Microsystems co-founder Scott McNeely.

The Giving Tree?

It's like I really liked your fifth grade book report about the giving tree, sorry I didn't want to hang out with you very much maybe give me another chance when you fumble this relationship time and time again.

And remember whenever you buy something at tpublic.com the money also goes to the artist so tpublic.com slash stores slash hdtgm now next week on the show we're going to be going over corrections and omissions for this episode but I'm sure you won't have any but if you do leave me a voicemail at 619-PAULASK or write a comment on our discord at discord.gg slash hdtgm and guess what June will be on next week's episode that's right a little deep dive how did this get made crossover you don't want to miss that one and remember uh joyful recollections of trauma is available wherever you get your books and if you're going out of town it's a great audio book with tons of how did this get made clips inside the reaction to the book has been amazing if you bought the book I thank you so much and just remind you to please tell people about it and rate and review it wherever you bought it because that actually really helps and has been spreading the word take a picture post a picture whatever you want to do I appreciate you all and remember you can find us anywhere you want online at hdtgm and if you listen on apple podcasts please rate and review us no matter what podcast app you use just rate and review like I just told you about my book now a big thank you to our producers Scott Sani and Molly Reynolds and our movie picking producer Averill Halley and our associate producer Jess Cisneros as well as our engineer Casey Holford we'll see you next week on Last Looks bye for now

This one's based on the Giving Tree and it's a papaya tree

And then it's like little baby you and the bottom of it

Exactly, little baby me even the bottom

This one's based on the Giving Tree and it's a papaya tree

And then it's like little baby you and the bottom of it

Exactly, little baby me even the bottom

And Jenna always tells the story, our stage manager, because he's like, that's not a real book.

And he just did not believe that the giving tree as he was in a full tree costume.

And I do have a picture from my monitor, my dressing room from rehearsal of this face in this tree costume, the giving tree. Yes.

The rumor did not believe obviously was not brought up on the giving tree.

I know books. I read a lot of books.

Maybe it's the prophet by Cleal Juberan maybe it's the giving tree by shell Silverstein maybe it's meditations of Marcus or Ilias one of my favorite books of all time you know but I think just being a minimalist is is so powerful build your life around a few things even in work I mentioned it rather than pushing at a thousand pieces of mediocrity do one thing incredibly well you know even if it takes five years ten years there's a chapter called make your project X in the wealth money camp by and the example is the Duomo in Milan you know how long they spent on it in this world where we want to do something in an hour and they get the rewards or maybe a week maybe a month it took 600 years to create the Duomo that these are values of a unspoken age 600 years of calibrating refining optimizing to create the Duomo and so that's what a project X is rather than doing lots of things you do one thing maybe it's one work of art Michelangelo took four years of working on the chapel of the Sistine ceiling but he got the job done so minimalism is very powerful.

Michael Crichton, Shel Silverston.

The Giving Tree.

So now I'm reading the self-help book, giving me gifts.

That one, the giving tree makes me cry.

Or just like, have you ever read the book The Giving Tree?

Which I'm trying to rewrite it as The Giving Condo. All there was was the shade of the condo. You can lay in the shade, you can't come in because you sold it to Russia.

The Giving Tree, the premise is the tree gives everything until finally all there is is a stump for the little boy to sit on who is now an old man.

And yeah, I have nothing left to give except stories.

Have you ever read the book The Giving Tree? Yeah. Where, which I'm trying to rewrite it as The Giving Condo.

This song makes me sad and so does the book, The Giving Tree. Always makes me sad.

You ever heard of the giving tree? The sequel is the caring whore

You ever heard of the giving tree? The sequel is the caring whore

Just look at the giving tree. The tree is female-coded and acts as a caregiver to the human male character. That motherly tree gave that boy everything. Shade, apples, even wood to build a home. And what did he do to pay her back? Turned her into a key of furniture.

We don't have enough compassion for that doctor... The Giving Tree... it's a heartbreaking book. I just read it to my kids last night.

It's the saddest book. I hate this book, but I love it at the same time.

I think it's a heartbreaking book. We just broke it down for way too long on the fact check.

Do you think it's like a wildly misogynistic book?

When I'm laying in bed with them, like last night, I read The Giving Tree. Terrible choice. Terrible choice. I love that book. And it's just the meanest book ever.

That boy is so mean to that tree. I didn't know that she was the mom in the book. I thought it was a wife. I was trying to figure out who the tree represented.

It's a good book about codependence. The book is about the cost of taking and the cost of giving when it's not reciprocated.

He cuts the tree down, but she was happy because he's sitting on her. It's a weird metaphor for the parentchild relationship and selfsacrifice.

The Giving Tree, but we had a perverted one too in our house.

We had The Giving Tree sitting on a shelf at our house.

we owned The Giving Tree, which is, of course, about a boy and this tree that gives everything down to the very material of its existence to the boy.

I kind of always hated that book - The Giving Tree - I read it and I found it incredibly weird and sad and disturbing.

Or The Giving Tree by Shal Silverstein. The Giving Tree.

Based off my love of my mother, Eve, and the book she used to read to me, The Giving Tree, I was going to get the best. But I was going to get a tree stump on my ankle.

In the book of Revelation, you see the whore of Babylon immediate...Or even the selling of women in short-term relationships for sexual purposes.

I was teaching the book of Revelation and I saw how John uses symbols to teach like apocalyptic literature.

We read the book of Revelation, we read the scriptures, we know there are calamities coming in the latter days.

I don't know what the Lord wants me to do first Peter 2 1 just told you when you get those five then come back and then ask me about the book of Daniel in the book of Revelations.

And yeah, there's a white horse that I read about in the book of Revelation.

The book of Revelations.

Book of Revelations, Walmart's, Revelations.

This recipe can also be found in the book of the revelation.

it all goes to the book of revelation in the new testament where as everyone knows if you've read the bible revelation is when they talk about it's when the bible gets really good and it's when it talks about the apocalypse and the beast and you know raining fire down from the heavens and stuff and it says this he causes all both great and small rich and poor free and slave to receive and he is the beast right sure yeah satan yeah uh to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads didn't say back on the neck no uh that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast or the number of his name

...it harkens back to even the supreme judge of the world which you know in revelation is Jesus Christ who sits on the throne and judges...

And by the way, if The New York Times and Steve Dase and Cruz and Knowles are all agreeing, that may actually be in the book of revelations a sign of the end times.

In the book of revelation it talks about end times and it says that in the end times Mankind's knowledge will increase exponentially Meaning multiples of itself That it will increase like that and I would argue that at no point in human history has knowledge increased more Exponentially than it has in the past 20 years.

If you were neither hot nor cold I will spit you out of my mouth and so his harshest judgment isn't reserved for outright unrepentant committed sinners and certainly not for people who are 100% committed to the courage of their faith but. But to the judgment is harshest for people who play both ends against the middle and who won't commit

The seven seals is a mystifying passage found deep within the book of Revelation.

He was saying to me that he would come out as soon as he wrote the seven seals.

And John has an entire book called the Book of Revelation.

And then 144,000, like it says in the book of Revelation, will be anointed to the heavens to rule as kings and priests with Jesus and Jehovah.

Well that's the point of the book of Revelation, that's the point of prophecy, so you won't be afraid.

it's the one that preachers don't teach, that no one really wants to read

Revelation was written by the apostle John at the end of his life, um, when he was basically a castaway at that point and he started receiving visions and prophecies and he wrote down what he saw

the book is absolutely incredible and it's not just revelation. Revelation ties back into Daniel, which was around thousands of years before John. Yes. It also ties into Matthew 24 and 2 Thessalonians 2 and 1 Corinthians and a lot of other places.

Revelation says that. Oh yeah, without the mark. You won't be able to buy or sell. Unless you bear the mark of the beast

Oh, get ready, because the King is coming. The King is coming back again.

The book of Revelation mentions false Jews, Revelation 2, 9, thou art blasted by them that say they are Jews and are not, but are of the synagogue of Satan.

I mean, I wouldn't be surprised they use holograms. I mean like they were already getting conditioned to it worth like Joe Biden having like his fake White House like what the fuck that's about right? You know, that's like that's not even argue that it's not true.

Right. Nero is the beast. But they must be writing much later I suppose... Well the Book of Revelation which portrays Nero as one of the two beasts... the Book of Revelation gives of Rome as the whore of Babylon, as this great sump of depravity and wealth and horror.

the book of revelations is kooky. You know, they really believe that Jesus is going to return on a white horse.

the Book of Revelations is weird.

And so, making the case that it might be better to be a giver than a taker was my first attempt to change the way he plays his game does not scream giver to me.

I think about the mindset of a good scientist as involving simple values like preferring humility over pride and curiosity over closure.

And that means you don't let your ideas become your identity, that when you have an opinion, you treat that as a hypothesis to be tested.

When ideas survive, it's not because they're true. It's because they're interesting.

The Science of Reasoning with Unreasonable People.

The Power of Knowing What You Don't Know.

Something that I loved that you wrote about in your book and in your in your latest book, and I relate to it so much because I released a book last fall, was that it can take two years to work on the book and write the book. And somebody could take somebody two hours to consume all of your ideas.

He is an organizational psychologist, professor and author of the book Think Again, the power of knowing what you don't know.

I really enjoyed the book... I'm excited to talk to you about it.

Adam Grant wrote the great book called Think Again, all about this moment.

He's the author of Think Again, The Power of Knowing What You Don't Know.

Psychologist Adam Grant is the author of Think Again, a book about the virtues of rethinking our positions.

University of Pennsylvania psychologist Adam Grant has written a book about the power of searching for the flaws in our own beliefs and arguments of challenging, deeply held views.

Adam Grant is the author of Think Again, The Power of Knowing What You Don't Know.

Adam Grant is an organizational psychologist at the Wharton School He is the author of Think Again The Power of Knowing What You Don't Know

Adam Grant is the author of Think Again a book about the virtues of rethinking our positions

Adam Grant is the author of Think Again, The Power of Knowing What You Don't Know

I wish I had whatever Adam has now like three bestselling books.

Adam Grant, your colleague has written this book called Think Again.

Today we don't change our opinions often enough. That's the focus of Adam Grant's new book here.

The reason why things evolve at all is because all these sort of crusty contancurus folks like you and me eventually we just croak and then new ideas can finally take hold.

I think it's time to rethink that. I think that last time I checked changing your mind can also be a sign of learning.

Arrogance is the combination of ignorance and conviction.

We laugh at people who use Windows 95, but we hold so strongly to opinions that we formed in 1995.

I read the book out of order because I read the audio book and all the chapters were jumbled up in the version that I got because I got like a pre-release so maybe this isn't how you start the book but it's how I started the book.

the reason why things evolve at all is because all these sort of crusty contancurus folks like you and me eventually we just croak and then new ideas can finally take hold

I think we've underestimated how willing people are to change their minds and I think we've underestimated in part because we have the wrong strategies for trying to open their minds but also because we live in a world that holds consistency up as a virtue.

arrogance is the combination of ignorance and conviction

we laugh at people who use windows 95 but we hold so strongly to opinions that we formed in 1995

And his most recent book is called Think Again, which you'll love, and I highly recommend you read.

You may learn to think again the way he's encouraged everyone to do.

I guess I've been thinking about, but I didn't really crystallize my understanding of it until I got to write about it and think again

The name of his most recent book is Think Again.

And that's what he wants you to do. He's got great stories. This is actually not one that we, that we got to with him, but it's worth reading his book just to find it.

It's about the guy who invented the BlackBerry and how his inability to think again, to sort of understand that his little keyboard wasn't going to be the be all and the end all and that the iPhone might actually have a fighting chance to take down his business was the reason his business failed. Right? That like he needed to think again to like re-evaluate the thing that made him a star and made him all that money.

And the author of *Think Again* and so many other books.

Adam's is called Think Again, which I really loved.

Adam, can you give us an overview of Think Again?

I'm reading this book, and it's like, why are you, you're like jumping ahead to the next idea, and I'm not done with the one you're on.

Adams, think again, is available wherever books are sold.

Adam's is called Think Again, which I really loved.

And Adam's Think Again is available wherever books are sold.

Adam, can you give us, can you give us an overview of Think Again?

My only critique of this, I have a critique of this book, by the way. I hope you have more than one. I have several. But my large one, which is a, is it's four books.

What I want to do is activate rethinking cycles where we have the humility to know what we don't know. We doubt some of our convictions. That makes us curious to go and discover new things.

He's also got this great new book. It's called think again

He's also got this great new book. It's called think again

it's impossible to learn that which you think you already know.

for the simplicity on this side of complexity, I wouldn't give a fig. But for the simplicity on the other side of complexity, I would give anything.

A great truth, people who have grit are more successful than people who don't. The opposite great truth, people who know when to quit are more successful than people who don't.

So let's say we'll take The Blind Side for instance. I didn't understand anything.

You know, I watched football my whole life. I didn't understand the importance of the left tackle.

Now, of course, people in football would. But you honed in on this idea of the left tackle.

And then you told it through the lens of this young man who was an incredible talent at left tackle.

The blind side, nobody wanted to make that movie.

Hey, a book before a movie. Yeah, the book. Yeah, the book. Sorry. Michael Lewis. Right. Yep.

He noted multiple times here where Lewis, quote, it is impossible to miss the differences in Lewis's treatment of Sam Bankman-Fried, a socially awkward young man afforded an ass empathy by the author, and Michael Orr, the socially awkward young man who Lewis treats as, quote, nearly mute spectator in his 2006 book, The Blind Side.

Just to remind you guys of what this movie was. It was, I think it was first a book and then the book was sold to be a movie. And it was this rich couple name, the, um, what were their names? The Tui family. And they had a daughter and a son. You remember the movie, they had a daughter and a son and they like lived in Texas or something, or I can't remember where, but they were Southern.

He is now coming forward and saying, um, that he signed these papers after he turned 18 and he thought they were adoption papers because in the movie they're like, you're part of the family. We want to adopt you. In fact, they, it was actually conservatorship just like Brittany, um, papers. And they said, but they said sign this cause you're over 18.

They said no, each kid in our family, Kim included got a hundred thousand. We each got a hundred thousand dollars for giving our life stories. For giving our life story to the movie that we never received any more movie. The two, we never received the two is are saying any more money from that movie either.

He didn't like the way he was portrayed. He was always playing football. He didn't like that he was portrayed like you didn't know how to read or write because he did at that time, you know, he did have a tough childhood and a broken home type of a situation, but that he didn't appreciate.

I do feel that, yeah, there was probably an element of, you know, Oh well, you know, I didn't ask to be portrayed like this, like, you know, amazing mother. I just told him my story and then they wrote it and then Hollywood knew what would make the story more compelling.

The hit book and movie Sandra Bullock won an Oscar for her portrayal of Leanne Tui.

The family that took in Michael Orr and he went on to become a big football star in the NFL.

They're basically in a divorce. They're in a very ugly fight.

He wants something like hundreds of thousands of dollars from them in maybe more, actually, that he says that they receive millions of dollars and he received nothing for the rights to his story.

The Tueys are denying it, Jason saying really none of this is true.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liar's Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liar's Poker.

Michael Oher, the real life subject of the book and movie The Blind Side, claimed that much of the film adaptation was based on a lie created by his supposed adoptive parents.

For those who might not remember, the film follows Oher as he is adopted out of poverty by the Tooheys, a wealthy white family, and takes his football career to the NFL.

Oher said that he didn't make any money from the movie based on his life, which earned more than $300 million.

But he alleges that the Tooheys and their two children were paid $225,000 plus 2.5% of the film's defined net proceeds.

In response to the petition, the Tooheys claimed that they made less than $15,000 from the movie and that they were quote, insulted by the allegations, which is so far beside the point that like, I, what?

I'll read the books well I don't read right so I watched Harry Potter same I'm sorry the blind side yeah yeah the blind side that's a book yeah it was a book

the blind side, you may remember that, it was a movie and it was a book where there was an African-American football player adopted by a white family in the South and the family raised the boy into college and he became a pro football player and it was a heartwarming story and all that.

It was a movie and it was a book where there was an African-American football player adopted by a white family in the South and the family raised the boy into college and he became a pro football player and it was a heartwarming story and all that.

And now it turns around and Michael Orr, the football player says he was exploited by the family and the family says that's a lot of baloney that we did everything we could to make this boy's life better and all of that.

I did, though I read the book before that too.

According to the movie and the book it was based on, Orr was adopted when he was a teenager by a wealthy white family, the Tuis.

The Blind Side of the movie was a fantastic hit.

And so at the same moment that he is moving in with this family, is the same moment that he gets identified as one of the top prospects in the entire country for college football.

And so I think it felt good to everybody even if it fell back on some classic tropes.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liar's Poker.

Hey there it's Michael Lewis, Arthur of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

Hey there it's Michael Lewis author of going infinite moneyball the blind side and liars poker

on every season of my podcast against the rules i take a broad look at various characters in american life the referee the coach the expert my next season is all about fans and with the rise of sports betting is doing to them to the teams and even to my family i'm heading to los vegas and new jersey and beyond to understand america's newest form of legalized gambling

on every season of my podcast against the rules i take a broad look at various characters in american life the referee the coach the expert my next season's all about fans and with the rise of sports betting is doing to them to the teams and even to my family i'm heading to los vegas and new jersey and beyond to understand america's newest form of legalized gambling

hey there it's michael lewis author of going infinite money ball the blind side and liars poker

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, Arthur of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, Arthur of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side and Liars Poker.

As a reminder, this was a movie starring Sandra Bullock, who won an Oscar for a role about Leanne Toohey, who brought homeless teenager Michael Orr into her family.

Orr, now former NFL player, is alleging that Toohey family never actually adopted him, instead put him into a conservatorship and exploited him for years.

The Toohey family's denying those claims, is making a few new claims of their own, even mentioning a shakedown for $15 million.

Michael Lewis seems to be backing, who wrote the book, The Blind Side, very well-known journalist, saying that nobody made money from this movie.

Well, it's a white savior complex. Yeah, exactly. But a lot.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

Every book was more or less the same.

Burleigh, former Navy SEAL, comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

It was an odd choice of reading for a honeymoon.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

And she was determined to get through all five books by the end of her trip.

Every book was more or less the same.

Burleigh, former Navy SEAL, comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

It was an odd choice of reading for a honeymoon.

A series of romance novels written by the dead man's wife.

Her books were packed with details borrowed from their own lives as a local Portland chef and a romance novelist.

Details that the DAs had no other way to get their hands on.

I wasn't so sure there would truly be anything, but it was sort of in the back of my mind, what if something similar to this has played out in one of her novels and it's all written right there for us to find.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

Every book was more or less the same. Burly former Navy SEAL comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

More shirts were going to be unbuttoned. More dresses were going to get unzipped.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

Every book was more or less the same. Burleigh, former Navy SEAL, comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

And she was determined to get through all five books by the end of her trip.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

And she was determined to get through all five books by the end of her trip.

Every book was more or less the same.

Burly former Navy SEAL comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

It was an odd choice of reading for a honeymoon.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

Every book was more or less the same.

Burley, former Navy SEAL, comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

It was an odd choice of reading for a honeymoon.

And for months, she and her team had been trying to solve a murder.

As the pressure mounted, Nicole and her team had turned to An Unlikely Lead, a series of romance novels written by the dead man's wife.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

Every book was more or less the same. Burly former Navy SEAL comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

Every book was more or less the same.

Burleigh, former Navy SEAL, comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

It was an odd choice of reading for a honeymoon.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series.

And she was determined to get through all five books by the end of her trip.

Every book was more or less the same.

Burleigh, former Navy SEAL, comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

It was an odd choice of reading for a honeymoon.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series, and she was determined to get through all five books by the end of her trip.

Every book was more or less the same. Burley, former Navy SEAL, comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

It was an odd choice of reading for a honeymoon. But away from the beaches of Croatia, back home in Portland, Oregon, Nicole was a deputy district attorney.

It was a little bit meta in terms of what we were dealing with. Her books were packed with details borrowed from their own lives as a local Portland chef and a romance novelist, details that the DAs had no other way to get their hands on.

I wasn't so sure there would truly be anything, but it was sort of in the back of my mind, what if something similar to this has played out in one of her novels and it's all written right there for us to find.

She was already on book number two in the Wrong Never Felt So Right series, and she was determined to get through all five books by the end of her trip.

Every book was more or less the same.

Burleigh, former Navy SEAL, comes to the rescue of beautiful young woman on the run from her dangerous husband.

More shirts were going to be unbuttoned. More dresses were going to get unzipped. And every new chapter, every new scene, could potentially be the one to crack the murder case that was waiting for her back home.

We just recorded a six episode series that will be aired later this year with the one and only Mighty Matt Walker, who wrote the marvelous book, Why We Sleep.

And then you explained how to define those needs.

And you beautifully described in-depth protocols for, let's call it, optimizing one's sleep.

And then you beautifully described the literature and actionable tools for connecting sleep to emotional health and mental health, as well as the relationship between lack of sleep and certain mental health challenges or conditions.

And I know there's a lot of interest in lucid dreaming. That is, one dreaming while being aware that one is dreaming.

And I'm really excited to dive into this topic since it's something that I've been fascinated by, and I know many people are fascinated by.

The best bridge between despair and hope is a good night of sleep.

In that 20 years of research, we have not been able to discover a single psychiatric condition in which sleep is normal.

It was a splendid pleasure to be back on the show. Thank you for having me.

The book "Why We Sleep" was written by Dr. Matthew Walker, a professor of neuroscience and psychology at the University of California, Berkeley. It discusses the relationship between sleep and learning, memory, and creativity.

The average school start time is somewhere around 7:30, 7:45.

That difference is non-trivial and it will change exactly where those individuals will go to university in terms of the tier of the university and likely change the trajectory of their lives.

We've got very consistent data. When you start school times later, academic grades improve, psychological and psychiatric problems decrease, truancy rates decrease.

The great Matt Walker who wrote the great book Why We Sleep.

And by the way, we have a sleep series with The Mighty Matt Walker coming out later this year.

He says, and I hope I'm getting this right, he says you need to warm up to cool down to go to sleep or to fall. Warm up to cool down to fall asleep. Stay cool to stay asleep. Warm up to wake up.

That's a straight bite out of Matt Walker's mouth, so he deserves that citation, not me.

To learn more about Dr. Walker's research and to learn more about his book and his social media handles please see the links in our show note captions

When I was researching data for my books some years ago, I did look into meditation and I wasn't a meditator.

But time and again I read paper after paper and the data was very strong and it was coming from research groups that I respected very much indeed.

And author of the bestseller, Why We Sleep? Unlocking the Powers of Sleep Plus Dream.

Matthew Walker's book Why We Sleep came out a few years ago. And I think society had a big awakening. Excuse the pun. At that point around sleep.

This book that I love called Why We Sleep by Matthew Walker. He's a neuroscientist. In it, he talks about sleep and dreams. It's very scientific, but then it's also very beautiful in the way that he speaks about dreaming and the idea of when we sleep, what's happening in our brains.

There's a great book called their circadian code by dr. Sachin Panda Great be a great guest for you But nonetheless, I mean he talks about how it's really important for us a Matthew Walker to for his book Why we sleep?

Oh, yeah I actually read about half of that book. Oh Joe Rogan, I think yeah Yeah

According to the sleep expert Matthew Walker, who's a professor of neuroscience and psychology at UC Berkeley and the author of the New York Times bestseller Why We Sleep, one out of three of us is chronically underslept.

He is also the author of the best-selling book, Why We Sleep.

And I think it's fair to say, I know it's fair to say that the cautionary notes that you spoke about in those early TED talks and in your book, Why We Sleep, while they may have stimulated some anxiety for some people, they absolutely had and have a net positive effect in the sense that they cued people to the importance of this thing called sleep because prior to you doing that or those things, it was the case that it was the, I'll sleep when I'm dead mentality.

and episode guest episode with the great Matthew Walker who wrote the book why you why we sleep incredibly important book all of those as well as our toolkit for sleep describe ways to improve your sleep so you can refer to those episodes if you're having challenges with sleep and want to improve on sleep

He will remind us and I'll remind you now that the quarter life of caffeine is 12 hours I mentioned this earlier but I'm going to repeat it again and that means that if you ingest caffeine at noon 25% of its effects more or less okay I'm using broad stroke here to talk about quarter life 25% of that is still going to be bioactive at midnight that night which will disrupt the early phase of your night the amount of slow wave sleep which then in turn will disrupt.

He's been on this podcast many other podcasts talking about the importance of sleep.

Dr. Walker told me and it's certainly supported by lots and lots of quality peer reviewed studies in animals and in humans that when alcohol is present in the brain and blood stream that the architecture sleep is disrupted slow wave sleep deep sleep and rapid I move in sleep all of which are essential for getting a restorative night sleep or all disrupted so for those of you that are drinking a glass or two wine or having a hard liquor drink or a beer in order to fall asleep the sleep you're getting is simply not.

Thanks to the great work of Professor Matt Walker at University of California Berkeley and the wonderful book that he wrote, Why We Sleep.

whose name I'm sure most of you are familiar with, wrote this wonderful book, Why We Sleep.

and he was also surprised to see these new data and I was surprised to see these new data that emphasized that if you get a poor night's sleep or if you're up late the previous night for good reasons, many people feel like they just want to go to bed early the next night but it turns out that's not the best thing to do for your immediate and long-term health.

Matt Walker's book Why We Sleep. Matt of course is a professor at UC Berkeley and why we sleep is a terrific book about why we sleep the science of sleeping and things you can do to improve your sleep.

also check out Matt Walker's triffit book while we sleep.

These studies just to remind you are structured the following way. An individual is brought into a laboratory does a spatial memory task.

They did this in different stages of sleep, non-rem sleep and rapid eye movement sleep, REM sleep.

What this means that you can cue the subconscious brain, the asleep brain to learn particular things better and faster.

It's remarkable because it really shows that sleep is an extension of the waking state.

If we didn't need eight hours of sleep and we could survive on six, Mother Nature would have done away with 25% of our sleep time millions of years ago.

Because when you think about it, sleep is an idiotic thing to do.

Matthew Walker is a professor of neuroscience and psychology at the University of California at Berkeley. He studies sleep, and he's the author of the book, Why We Sleep.

And I do hope you sleep well tonight.

I hope you have sweet dreams tonight.

If sleep does not provide a remarkable set of benefits, then it's the biggest mistake the evolutionary process has ever made.

Matthew Walker is a professor of neuroscience and psychology at the University of California at Berkeley. He studies sleep and he's the author of the book, Why We Sleep.

Matthew Walker is a professor of neuroscience and psychology at the University of California at Berkeley. He studies sleep and he's the author of the book, Why We Sleep.

You know, sleep is the Swiss Army knife of health.

I re-read this book, this is my favorite book probably in the world. The Obstacle is the Way is a book I read at least once a year.

Ryan Holiday wrote a book called 'The Obstacle Is The Way' about this. So many people see obstacles, and they're like 'Oh, this is terrible.' But you know what? They're not terrible. Obstacles are opportunities for growth.

I know this is what Ryan Holiday talks about, the obstacle is the way and all that, but maybe I'm freshly inspired by having visited him this week down in Austin, but more than that, I guess what I'm saying is there's really no sense of lamenting what could have been because in all likelihood, what could have been never existed in the first place, what does exist, what did happen, that's probably much more interesting and much more meaningful than our fantasy of a life without challenges, without obstacles.

He wrote Obstacle is the Way.

I went there while I was writing The Obstacle Is The Way.

And this is effectively the idea of The Obstacle Is The Way, that everything is an opportunity to practice virtue, to be made better by what you went through if you choose to do so.

And I've got a great little reminder of this, The Obstacle Is The Way coin, which you can grab at store.dailystoic.com.

To me, that's kind of what the idea of the obstacle is the way is that these unpleasant, unchosen, undesirable situations are practice for harder things down the road.

I did this book, The Obstacle Is the Way, and I think for some reason when people hear that, they're going like, you're supposed to go through the obstacle, right?

But no, the idea is that in struggling with the obstacle and failing, you come up with another way around, right? Or because that path is blocked, you end up going in a very different direction that you wouldn't have thought of otherwise, and that becomes the way, right?

And then in having to come up with a new way, you discover that that should have been the way all along.

Chris and I talked books. Chris and I actually did a book together, which I always recommend to people called Letters to a Young Athlete because he had been talking about the ideas in the obstacle's way, which one of his coaches had given him.

He's trying to remind himself that we don't control what happens. We control how we respond to what happens.

This is, I think, a formula not just for individual greatness, but also this is what entrepreneurs do. This is what investors do. We don't control where the market is going, but we control how we orient what we do in response to what the market is doing.

We figure out what virtues this situation is going to draw out of us, what we're going to bring to it, what we're going to take out of it.

When I wrote The Obstacle Is Away, I definitely knew that there had been certain classical works that had crossed over, like in the business world, you know, whether it's Machiavelli or Sun Tzu.

And it's funny, like for some reason, I don't know where they're categorized here, but most bookstores have my books in the business section just because that's where The Obstacle Is Away was for.

Because if they have someone that comes into therapy and they are into the kind of videos that you do and stuff, and they resemble your kind of audience, then a CBT therapist might be going to read Obstacles Away by Ryan Holiday.

This next year will be the 10th anniversary of The Obstacle Is The Way.

And I don't know if there's one thing I'd be like, oh, I'd change this chapter.

I'd get rid of this as I've written more.

And when I look back on anything I've written, the one thing that never ages well, I found is like certainty or glibness.

It is the perfect book.

I'm not saying that.

I'm not saying that.

I just I don't look in the rear view mirror.

And it starts at a young age. Like you just get inculcated X, Y, and Z. Choose the path you want to go. And this is the path. And you get a house and you get insurance and you whatever. And you keep going and blah, blah, blah. And they've taught this, right?

This is a T O I T W.

The obstacle is the way working draft end of day.

That's April 4th, 2013.

I was working on this book.

I may have been on that day writing this very chapter of the obstacle is the way one of my favorite chapters in my first book on Stoicism.

That's a Ryan holiday book. I want to make sure I give shout outs.

You wrote in, The Obstacle is the Way. And I think we quoted this in our book, there is no good or bad without us. There is only perception. There is the event itself and the story we tell ourselves about what it means.

If you can't fix it, you got to stand it. Isn't that Brokeback Mountain?

The Obstacles Away sold something like 3,300 copies its first week.

That that would go on and ultimately sell a million copies and then 2 million copies. Again, unreal to me. Could have never imagined it.

I recorded this walking around New York City when I was there back in June for the launch of Right Thing Right Now.

The obstacles away came out in 2014 so that's 10 years to today but it took six maybe seven years for it to hit a bestseller list.

I think they bought a bunch of copies of one of my books in exchange for me coming to talk. Obstacle is the Way I got a copy of that.

Ryan Holiday, author of The Obstacles the Way, Ego is the Enemy, Stillness is the Key, and of course The Daily Stoic as I explain the ideas behind the words and shed light on the path that you're on but that I am also on because again we are all struggling to tame our temper and we will all be better if we can get closer to that.

And obviously this is the idea behind The Obstacle's Way, right? The book that I wrote almost 10 years ago now that sort of kicked off everything, including this podcast, right? The idea that the impediment to action can advance action. What stands in the way can be the way that, as Marcus says, using the same metaphor of fire, that everything we throw in front of the fire is fuel for it.

And if you haven't read the book, I hope you check it out and grab it anywhere books are sold. I hope you check out some of the stuff.

90% of the talks I give are still about The Obstacle Is Away, a book I wrote 10 years ago.

Whether that's the success that came from The Obstacle Is Away book versus it's time to write the next one.

I think I found her on Instagram. Also, she'd posted herself reading a copy of the obstacle is the way she competed in the last Tokyo Olympics in the women's cross country mountain bike race.

Obstacle is the Way by Ryan Holiday, Art of Resilience by yourself on Audible.

Ryan's books, like his new one, Discipline is Destiny, which is available right now. Number one New York Times bestsellers, multiple. Some of my favorite ones, The Obstacle is the Way, Ego is the Enemy, The Daily Stoic.

The Obstacle Is The Way came out just to just sort of illustrate this idea that nobody knows anything.

I had the idea for the obstacle is the way and the publisher said that idea is half as good as your last idea.

And they have a kind of philosophy around anti-racism that comes out of critical race theory and their philosophy is that you know a white guy like you should be more or less constantly thinking about how your whiteness has uh given you privilege how your how how your whiteness blinds you to the realities that a black person like me can see

And on di angelo's account you are supposed to be constantly different to black people in conversation so she literally says in her book if you and i are talking about race you as a white guy me as a black guy you were not supposed to disagree with what i have to say about race you're not supposed to argue back you're not supposed to remain silent you're not supposed to get defensive

Yeah, now that now you have like books like White Fragility and stuff like that with the whole intersectional stuff taking taking precedence in the humanities and essentially the overall left.

Neo-racist like Rob DiAngelo, they say that to be white is to be ignorant for example.

That's actually mistresses sounding what what Robin DiAngelo's position is.

It's in her book but a lot.

So I told you I read Robin Angelo's White Fragility, So I'm All Set, that's the equivalent of the, I don't trust your fucking judgment.

I mean, and me and Robin are tight. I love Robin. I'm just saying probably half the people that are listening to this read that book.

That's what I'm saying. They read it and they, and it was good and they ain't read it again since.

They haven't grabbed another white body and said for the next 30 years, me and you going to roll around race specifically.

And we are going to cultivate between ourselves a different way of understanding this. And we may not be able to get to what we think we need to get to, but at least we're going to nibble on this.

there's a difference between things, but we sort of conflate them all and we have this debate and it probably isn't that helpful.

a positive white identity is an impossible goal. White identity is inherently racist. White people do not exist outside the system of white supremacy.

a positive white identity is an impossible goal. White identity is inherently racist. White people do not exist outside the system of white supremacy.

And we've got White Fragility by Robin DiAngelo.

There's a book called white fragility by Robin DiAngelo.

I'm a big believer in affinity space and affinity work and I think people are going to need to get away from white people and have some community with each other.

There ain't nobody that's more white supremacist than uh that woman that wrote White Fragility.

You remember what Robin DiAngelo wrote right about everyone is racist everything she said about black people and also in any given situation It's not a question of whether racism occurred. It's how did racism manifest itself?

Right now the most popular, the most well selling or best selling books are white fragility by DeAngelo and I can't remember her first name and then there's Robin DeAngelo

I really don't think that often about Robin DiAngelo I know she wrote a book called White Fragility which was published last year and was all the rave I found it in coherent but I learned why what what was in cool and maybe this isn't productive like I don't want to I don't want to push you into commenting on Robin DiAngelo maybe that's just not a reasonable place for this court

white fragility

I'd love to debate Robin DiAngelo, race huckster, author of White Fragility and other unreadable terms.

Our leaders are too uncomfortable with this. We've actually lost contracts when people have said we want to do anti-racism work and we go in and they say, oh, this is what you mean by anti-racism work? Oh, we we didn't. That's not what we signed up for.

So you see that on that fragility centering white comfort is so alive and well.

I'm a big believer in affinity space and affinity work. And I think people of color need to get away from white people and, and have some community with each other.

Robin DiAngelo, the Miss Whiplash of anti racism says there is no good form of whiteness. There is no good form of being white.

That's what it's from. And they just read that book and took those lines out of that book.

And they just read that book and took those lines out of that book.

Frankly, White Fragility is literally the worst book I've ever read.

i had a lot of friends post the black square after um after george floyd happened over the summer and i've just seen a lot of confusion among christian women who are my age who just want to know hang on what is actually true because i'm confused this sounds good this sounds right but there's something about it that doesn't seem quite true

What's like the hottest book on the left right now? It's White Fragility.

What's the subtitle of White Fragility? I don't know what it is exactly, but in essence, it's something like how white people can blah, blah, blah. That's racist.

That in and of itself is racist. Forget white fragility.

It goes on to talk about the book, White Fragility as you know this book White Fragility which is being pushed everywhere and has been debunked a gazillion times.

Robin DiAngelo gave us the phrase white fragility. She teaches, writes and consults from Seattle.

Robin, because we haven't met before and you haven't been on the show, I am curious. The only thing that I saw as I was looking around about the background of your life was somewhere you said or you wrote that you grew up poor and white in San Francisco.

Robin DiAngelo, who's known for her work on white fragility

Well, um, Rezma's literary agent reached out and told me about Rezma's book and that Rezma loved my work.

The Robin D'Angelo one where you gave that guy money for reparations and you got her, she thought it was uncomfortable.

When we had the idea for the film to talk about race, we knew we needed to get Robin D'Angelo.

I didn't think we'd get her because I figured she'd be a lot more cautious.

But apparently she has no idea what's happening outside of her bubble at all.

So she didn't know who I was. I mean, I gave her my name and she had no clue.

The only remedy to present discrimination is future discrimination. The only remedy to past discrimination is present discrimination.

The only remedy to present discrimination is future discrimination. The only remedy to past discrimination is present discrimination.

The Wages of Woke. How Robin DiAngelo got rich peddling white fragility.

Robin DiAngelo is the author of an incredibly big selling book called White Fragility.

It was the top of the New York Times bestseller list for weeks at a time.

It sold hundreds of thousands if not millions of copies and it is complete and utter tripe.

It's right there in the title of the founding text of the field, Adam Smith's book, An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations.

It's not the same thing as what Marx was critiquing in the 1800s.

You don't live in a capitalist system as described by Adam Smith and the wealth of Nations.

Scottish man in 1976 wrote his Wealth of Nations, which basically said the government should not interfere with matters of finance and economics.

Scottish man in 1976 wrote his Wealth of Nations, which basically said the government should not interfere with matters of finance and economics.

Scottish man in 1976 wrote his Wealth of Nations, which basically said the government should not interfere with matters of finance and economics.

There should be the invisible hand guiding all these principles.

Scottish man in 1976 wrote his Wealth of Nations, which basically said the government should not interfere with matters of finance and economics.

There should be the invisible hand guiding all these principles.

You know, you have all these people on this assembly line making pins.

But Alexis de Tocqueville asks, what can be expected of a man who has spent 20 years of his life putting heads on pins?

You know, as I believe Adam Smith points out in Wealth of Nations, you know, you have all these people on this assembly line making pins.

They know about the Wealth of Nations and they know that Margaret Thatcher, the enemy, always had a copy of Wealth of Nations, the legend goes, in her handbag.

She didn't read the first book, The Theory of Moral Sentiments, clearly.

But she read the second one and she did use that as an authority to promote her economic theories and activities and policies.

When Adam Smith was writing The Wealth of Nations in the mid-18th century, it wasn't supermarkets he was worried about. It was trading firms like the English East India Company, which grew so massive that it began acting like a sovereign, as Smith put it.

Writing in The Wealth of Nations, Smith blamed the severity of the famine on the East India Company's improper regulations and injudicious restraints.

By preferring the support of domestic to that of foreign industry, he intends only his own security. And by directing that industry in such a manner as its produce may be of the greatest value, he intends only his own gain. And he is in this, as in many other cases, led by an invisible hand to promote an end which was no part of his intention.

Great Britain have for more than a century past amused the people with the imagination that they possessed a great empire on the west side of the Atlantic. This empire, however, has hitherto existed in imagination only.

It has hitherto been not an empire, but the project of an empire, not a gold mine, but the project of a gold mine.

A project which has cost, which continues to cost, and which if pursued in the same way as it has been hitherto, is likely to cost immense expense without being likely to bring any profit.

For a very small expense, the public can facilitate, can encourage, and can even impose upon almost the whole body of the people the necessity of acquiring those most essential parts of education.

If you go at it with the mindset that this is a book of economics, the way that we understand the field of economics today, you're going to narrow your field of vision.

What was Smith's primary purpose of publishing that book or what did he hope would come of it? I think that Smith is hoping that educated readers will understand that national wealth is not measured in terms of gold and silver coin, and that actually you need to pay attention to output. You need to pay attention to how people are producing and where they're producing and what they're producing.

It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker that we expect our dinner but from their regard to their own interest. We address ourselves not to their humanity but to their self-love.

The Wealth of Nations is an attack on the entire commercial system of Great Britain?

By telling a small story about the pin factory, Adam Smith was making a larger argument about some of the ingredients required for a thriving economy. Division in labor and the division of labor.

His two great books were The Wealth of Nations, as is well known, but also The Theory of Moral Sentiments.

His second book, 'The Wealth of Nations', that's the short name of it, which many people know established that reputation.

you should read Wealth of Nations by Adam Smith because he talks about monopolies and why monopolies are bad explicitly.

Adam Smith's first book was actually about ethics. The second book was actually about the wealth of nations and His view is There has to be a moral society for capitalism to be able to work its magic on yes, right.

Also, the invisible hand is not mentioned near as often in that book as people might think.

Also, the invisible hand is not mentioned near as often in that book as people might think.

Also, the invisible hand is not mentioned near as often in that book as people might think. So so when you hear somebody talking about the invisible hand, make sure they actually read Adam Smith, just a pro tip there.

I read this great book once called The Wealth of the Wealth and Poverty of Nations by man named Richard Landis and he analyzed Japan in particular because he thought Japan was a very interesting case history the Japanese have a very disciplined culture and after World War 2 was a westernized culture and Japan is very very wealthy but Japan has no natural resources so then you might say well what's the basis of Japanese wealth and the answer is something like well it's an ethos the Japanese are very disciplined and the fundamental transaction between two Japanese is honest I think you could say that there isn't any other natural resource except air maybe there we breathe the only natural resource is trust and trust is predicated on like you can't trust productively unless people are honest and if people are honest and trustworthy then they can cooperate in a manner that makes abundance not only possible but inevitable and that means that the technology has to be embedded in an ethos and that ethos has to facilitate trust and so the way that you make a society rich isn't as a consequence of them being blessed with natural resources say or even with technological prowess it's that all of that's embedded in an ethos and and that ethos is the one that enables people to cooperate and compete productively and generously and that's the ethos that seems to be laid out in the biblical corpus and though that's the case you're making in your book I agree and you could just ask yourself to it I mean you think about our technological advances you think about AI now but why is it I mean if you look at science alone my contention would be science alone is at a loss to explain why those who are not the most intelligent however you define it why those who are not the strongest however you define that why they should not be privileged in some way in other words if you look at what what's the natural world where that is true right and this is Darwin natural selection and you had the social Darwinists of the last century who we rightly despise and condemn now but they would have said that's just science we're just applying to the human realm what we've observed in the natural scientific realm and why should it be that those who have the AI technology that can displace thousands of workers why should they not be the ones who have most power in society I don't think science can rely on that to us well there's irrationality there like I think the rational stance is that if I can take what you have then why shouldn't I yes a why isn't that a rational stance in fact right the Romans would have thought that was a rational stance absolutely and the Greeks would have thought that was a rational stance and I would say it's partly because it does have its own self evidence if you're weak and despicable and I can just take what you have and there's nothing you can do to stop me why isn't it the case that your own contemptible weakness isn't evidence that I should be allowed to do whatever I want with you that is not irrational now that doesn't mean it's not wrong and so now I would dispute you know I would dispute to some degree if you don't mind momentarily the the the the social Darwin or Darwinist argument you know because I talked a lot to friends to wall the primatologist and you know do wall has shown quite clearly that among chimpanzees who do have quite a patriarchal social structure and who are extraordinarily powerful physically and brutal beyond belief like they hunt colibus monkeys those things weigh 38 pounds and they eat them when they're alive right there's no pity in chimps and so the chimps will tear each other apart and they do that in their chimp war but do wall has shown very clearly in his analysis of the chimps that he's studied over the last 20 years that the biggest roughest toughest social Darwin triumph male is very very likely to meet an unbelievably violent end and to rule very briefly over a very unstable and malfunctioning community he showed that the the stable alpha males sometimes they're the smallest male in the troop they're the most reciprocal individuals in the entire troop male or female they do the best at tracking social relationships and engaging in essentially reciprocal altruism and so that's the state that's the basis for a stable polity even among chimpanzees so it's another bit of evidence but this time from the scientific side that power it doesn't look like in a biological community or in many biological communities that its power and dominance per se that are associated with let's say biological success reproductive success so you know there are situations baboons are more baboons are more violent but even then it's it's not by no means as simple as the most powerful male is the one who propagates this genes forward and it's certainly not the case in complex social organizations not true with rats for example

If you look at his his theory of capitalism the wealth of nations if you look at his theory of moral sentiments which I think he actually wrote beforehand you can see that it's embedded in a particular social context which is frankly very biblically informed and when you divorce it from that context you get something that I suspect he would not have approved of he would have said oh wait wait wait wait no no no no that's what I'm talking about so I think that that's where we are with with much of that I am not a Losefare conservative I never have been and in my party that's heretical to say that you know you don't believe in Losefare but I just you know I am not because I think that it does not capture these deeper intuitions that you've been talking about and it does not preserve the most important things in life and in the nation you know a nation is not a corporation a nation is not premised on pursuit of profit you know I have nothing against pursuit of profit in the business realm that's great but that's not what a nation is you know a nation is held together by mutual bonds of belonging a shared sense of purpose and moral vision that's what a nation is and we've got to we have to preserve that tend that and cultivate it if we don't we end up where we are now which is at daggers drawn

Think of Adam Smith's contribution, The Wealth of Nations, The Theory of Moral Sentiments.

I might rewrite Adam Smith's The Wealth of Nations in terms of the formation of stars. The formation of life, death, and stars.

One of the founders of economic science Before Adam Smith Was the...

Adam Smith's great work The Wealth of Nations 1776

That's right

The real title of it is An inquiry into the nature

And causes of the wealth of nations

Adam Smith's great work The Wealth of Nations 1776

The real title of it is An inquiry into the nature And causes of the wealth of nations

The poor man's son whom heaven in its anger has visited with ambition admires the condition of the rich...he sacrifices a real tranquility that is at all times in his power...Power and riches appear then to be what they are enormous machines contrive to produce a few trifling conveniences to the body...

So when Adam Smith writes The Wealth of Nations and he walks into some guy's office, it's pulling the strings, and he just slams his book on his desk, he says, wow, capitalism, read it.

While he was there, he started writing The Wealth of Nations. It took him 10 years to finish.

Smith was describing what he saw around him. It sounds simple and shockingly, it really sort of is. There was private property, there were firms and those firms wanted to make profits.

and one of the wealth of nations

That's pages 499 to 606 in my book and later in this episode our special book club guest is Mike Shorter He is the creator behind beloved sitcoms like parks and recreation the good place Brooklyn 99

I love it's such a it's such a New York II way to say it

And then the next paragraph starts the new parkways solve the problem for about three weeks and this is I love it's such a it's such a New York II way to say it

But I mean apparently probably part of the procedure who knows anyway but the I I also just like this this part of this doesn't work on me I mean I own a couple of cars you know like a big family but I do not enjoy driving

I've gone on trips where I have to drive down Canal Street and it takes more than 26 minutes because it's so incredibly traffic jam

What struck me about this book from the beginning was I knew who Robert Caro was. I had never read his books, but like I'd known a little bit about his story.

The very first thing is just it's kind of he's realizing a dream for so many of us, you know, like the idea of turning every page is a real luxury.

It kind of has the vague shape of a conspiracy theory like instead of you know infrastructure being done by committee and through goodwill and trying to make the world better place.

The truth is that real conspiracies operate like this in sort of banal ways in paper pushing and behind the scenes meetings and you know through the New York Times and it's like it takes however many pages several hundred over a thousand something.

It's almost like you are vaccinating someone against that conspiracy theory with another conspiracy that is kind of a dead conspiracy.

I love this book.

I feel great. I do think that I mean in my sort of public persona, especially on my podcast, I do talk about my love of like, you know, city subways and urbanism and you know thing like some maybe that's.

Well, I don't know. Do you want my life story here? It's not going to be that long but so I'm the child of two New York City journalists reporters.

I've been very very just adorably listening to the stuff you guys have put out so far.

I think I made the right choice, will see what life turns out. I mean dionetics is got a got a big volcano on the cover that's pretty exciting.

If you haven't already pick up a copy of the power broker by Robert Carroll and join our Power broker book club new episodes of the 99% visible breakdown of the power broker hosted by me and Elliot Kalin.

If you haven't already done so You should pick up a copy of The Power Broker by Robert Caro And join our year-long Power Broker book club New episodes of the 99% visible breakdown of The Power Broker Hosted by me and Elliot Kalin Will drop monthly right here in this feed It is so much fun I hope you can join us

You can find us on all the usual social media And we just started up a 99PI Discord server Come join me and the rest of the staff To talk about The Power Broker You know, what you've been reading Architecture, recommendations, books, podcasts You're listening to, anything As long as it is, you know, fun and nice You can find a link to that As well as every past episode of 99PI At 99PI.org

If you haven't already, pick up your copy of The Power Broker by Robert Caro, and you can join our Power Broker discussion book club.

You can talk about architecture, you can talk about books, you can talk about movies, as long as you're nice, you can talk about whatever you want to.

I learned about the power broker when I first started to cover cities and infrastructure on the radio, this massive book that's about 1,200 pages long is the most important and complete explanation of how cities are formed, how neighborhoods are destroyed

Bridges are erected, roads are laid down, parks are designed, fortunes are made, lives are ruined, and power is amassed.

The Power Broker, which is subtitled Robert Moses and the Fall of New York, changed all that. It is a tour de force of journalism, history, and biography.

I also think it is really fun to read and is strongly in contention for the best book ever written.

He's the man behind the parks. He's the man who builds parks, he builds bridges, he builds roads and he wants to build this enormous bridge across the Long Island Sound.

Robert Caro says how did this guy get this power?

Robert Caro is the closest thing to like a geological formation, his work, his body of work feels like we're watching this eruption of lava that takes and moving of tectonic plates that's going to build something and it's gonna last as long as civilization lasts.

I've read it once before and you've read it once before we're reading again for the project of this podcast which, thank you Roman for asking me to be part of this, because for years I said I'm gonna reread the power broker someday.

It's an amazing story about how power works and what one person can do to completely change the face of an American city, and I'm telling you it's riveting and it's powerful.

pages 703 to 806 in my book and later in this episode our special guest is Shiloh Frederick

pages 703 to 806 in my book

I think this is where I'm getting off the train. We're getting out of the car

I'm gonna take you talk to you about bank finances

the city section of

I never had the faintest interest in writing a book just to tell the life of a great man.

I said, if you pick the right man, you can use the life of a man to show what you want to show about political power.

Now, Moses did something that no one else has done before.

He was a guy who was never elected. He had more power than anyone who was elected, more than any governor, more than any mayor and governor combined, and he held that power, think of this, for 44 years, and with it, he shaped the whole metropolitan area.

I said, oh, I have to show this just like I showed how he wielded power. I have to show the effect of power on the powerless. I have to really write about this neighborhood.

I never had the faintest interest in writing a book just to tell the life of a great man.

He was never elected to anything that had so much power, where did he get it?

If you can figure out how and why he did it, then you will be getting to the essence of power.

He had more power than anyone who was elected, more than any governor, more than any mayor and governor combined, and he held that power, think of this, for 44 years, and with it, he shaped the whole metropolitan area.

He goes, there was an alternate route just two blocks away that paralleled this route. He tore down 54 six- and seven-story apartment houses for this one mile. If he took the other route two blocks away, parallel, exactly the same, it would require, as I recall, him to tear down just six little tenements.

I've read it. It's so good. It's daunting but power through it. It really is worth it.

I'm Roman Mars, and I'm here to talk about the book by former New York City planner Robert Moses. So I'm breaking it down 100 pages at a time and talking to special guests about why this book matters, like Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.

I actually think if it wasn't for Robert Moses, I probably wouldn't have run for Congress.

I love the book The Power Broker, the epic biography of former New York City planner Robert Moses.

I love the book, The Power Broker, the epic biography of former New York City planner, Robert Moses.

I actually think if it wasn't for Robert Moses, I probably wouldn't have run for Congress.

I am on volume five of my five volume commentary on the Torah, the first five books Bible Bible.

Nobody writes a Bible commentary to get rich. I write it to touch lives.

She also sued NASA for allowing astronauts to broadcast readings from the book of Genesis while they orbited the moon.

And this is the most important reason, because God said so. As I said a minute ago, look it up in the book of Genesis. It's right up there on your desk, Mr. President.

In the Genesis story, they are prevented.

So what is different then from what's going on here in chapter 8 is because it's not that God never wants humans to partake of the fruit of the tree of life, but he doesn't want them to do it in a fallen state. He'd rather he did it in a redeemed state.

That to me explains Genesis.

I don't know if you know this, Genesis chapter 37, it won't be on the screen for you. I'm just going to tell you up to trust me that I'm giving you the correct Bible verse. But the Bible says that Joseph's brothers, if you remember this, the coat of many colors, they didn't like him. They threw him into the pit. Y'all tracking with me?

They threw him into the pit. And then whenever there was some Israelites came along, but they were Israelites that were Midianite traders. So same group of people, same pressure. Joseph determines that no matter the circumstance or the situation, whether I'm in the pit or I'm in Potiphar's house or I am in the prison, the Bible says the hand of the Lord was with him and that he rose to the top in the middle of every situation because pressure will either refine you or it will confine you.

Inspired by the book of Genesis.

Previously we saw how Joseph's brothers sold him into slavery and that he was sent to Egypt.

Today you will hear a very different story.

And it came to pass after these things that his Master's wife cast her eyes upon Joseph, and she said, ...Lie with me.

Joseph is a bright young man and excellent man, a great spirit was in him and with hard work he soon proves himself trustworthy to his master potter, a man in Egypt of great influence and power.

The Lord led me to Genesis chapter 32 for our lesson today.

I've been reading through the book of Genesis with Elijah and Kelsey, and it's been so fun.

I knew I would preach it soon because it grabbed me in a new way.

Look at Genesis, chapter 32, verse 21.

We're going to see this Bible character Jacob in a wrestling match.

it's called the law first mentioned which means that that very often specifically in the book of genesis if you see something mentioned for the first time that might be a picture picture or a pattern of how that thing's going to be seen throughout the thread of scripture

when we see the enemy's interaction with the human species for the very first time what did he try to create he tried to create an identity crisis

you go all the way back to genesis 1 you'll see when God's having a conversation about creation he says let us make man in our image and likeness so satan tells eve God knows if you eat that you'll be like him but in genesis 1 when he created adam and eve he created them in his image and likeness

Why don't we do this? Let's go to Genesis 49.

So now I want to back up to Genesis 49 and give you a picture of the Bible character we spoke about last week who was Joseph and what his father Jacob said to him before he died.

Now listen to this. Jacob has been speaking to all of his sons, all 12 of them.

Now first point the one who went through the most, the one who had gone through the most, the one who endured the most was blessed the most.

I want to revisit Genesis 50 from last week and kind of take it a little bit deeper than what I was able to share let's go beneath the surface of this conversation just to remind you

If you brought your Bible or you have your phone, turn to Genesis chapter one, you'll know this. I've actually heard Stephen preach on this multiple times.

Then God said, let us make man in our image after our likeness and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over the livestock and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. So God created man in his own image. In the image of God, he created him male and female. He created them.

Genesis 3, the serpent, the symbolism, revelations.

It's in Genesis 48. It's really beautiful.

God sent Joseph to Egypt, and on one hand, his brothers betrayed him and sold him, but on the other hand, Joseph saw, after 13 years of what seemed to be like a setback...

When Jacob was getting ready to die, he called Joseph to his bedside. It's a really beautiful scene. This is great for Father's Day. Genesis, chapter 48.

Genesis 48, 11 is the one I want to focus your heart on for a moment. '"Israel said to Joseph..."' You're like, '"Wait a minute. I thought you were talking about Jacob."'' I am.

Joseph took both of them, Ephraim on his right hand toward Israel's left hand, and Manasseh on his left toward Israel's right hand, and brought them close to him. All of this I saw when I saw it happen on the plot of ground that Jacob gave his son Joseph.

Genesis chapter 1. Chapter 1 says, 'In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth, and the earth was without form and void, and darkness covered the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God was moving over the face of the waters.'

Let's go in our Bibles now to Genesis chapter 40 for the final week of our series Trigger...

I Mentioned him and I read this scripture that I want to revisit now in Genesis chapter 40 concerning the power of interpretation

Which is what put him in this position in Genesis chapter 40 the situation he was in

I believe this Genesis 41. Yeah verse 15 Pharaoh said to Joseph I have had a dream, and there is no one who can interpret it

I'm gonna read it to you. Just like it says it in verse 1 start from verse 1 of Genesis 45 He's been with his brothers...

Well let's talk about the Bible first because in the book of Genesis God made a covenant with Abraham

So I've written a commentary on Genesis, Exodus, Numbers in Deuteronomy. I'm working on Leviticus. And Charlie has listened to 240 hours of my teachings on this now. I've now done it in printable, the rational Bible.

It's called the rational Bible there of three volumes out the fourth volumes coming out here. If volume.

I hope they will read my Bible coming. It's life changing. I don't say that lightly.

if those two things are true everything else in the Bible can be true from the incarnation to Joan on the whale

the fascinating part to me about Joseph being sold into slavery is that if Joseph wasn't sold into slavery the Israelites all would have starved to death in that famine

You can learn about the stories in the book of Genesis,

if we're looking at Genesis I think that we need to put Genesis back in its context if you read Genesis as if it is a contemporary textbook on science I think what you're doing is is wrenching it out of its original context and therefore you're bound to misread it and that's true of not just Genesis is really to have any work that to understand that we need to understand it's genre and we need to understand this context

what is the original context of the Genesis story well the original context it was written in terms of rival stories of creation other stories that were circulating in the ancient world and it was meant to be an answer to those and it uses poetry it uses imagery and that was what all those stories did and the poetry in the imagery I would not set that against truth as if on the one hand you have truth and the other hand you have poetry imagery and story I think that one kind of truth is scientific truth the empirically verifiable but I think it's too narrow to say well the only kind of truth is the empirically verifiable I think truth actually is broader.

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He's hunched over, holding a white book.

Then, he offers her a book to read. I'm not sure what the book is, but Marthe refuses.